DoG's Top 100 Test Bowlers Countdown Thread 100-1

[Days of Grace]

Therefore, When considering McGrath versus Imran, I'd pick Shahid Afridi.

And on that note, let's get back to the topic at hand.

No.15

Clarrie Grimmett (Australia) 846

Quality Points: 772
Career Points: 74

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAqe_oDtd6c

Career: 1925-1936
Wickets: 216
Gold Performances: 3
6/37 vs. England at Sydney 1925 (15.63)
6/167 vs. England at Lord's 1930 (15.40)
5/64 vs. England at The Oval 1934 (15.14)
Silver Performances: 10
Bronze Performances: 9

Overall Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings: 23.30 (24.22) 60.15 (67.19) 6.63 (no.9)
50 Innings Peak Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings (1930-1936): 21.55 58.63 6.84 (rank 29)
Non-Home Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings: 22.38 61.26 7.24 (rank 5)
Quality Opposition Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings: 29.53 72.28 5.84 (rank 56)

Owner of the fourth-highest career PPI of all-time, Clarrie Grimmett has a unique story. Born in Dunedin, he moved to Australia in 1914 as New Zealand were not yet a test-playing nation. He eventually made his debut for Australia at age 33 in the final test of the 1924/25 Ashes, achieving a gold performance in the dead rubber.

He became the first bowler to achieve the milestone of 200 wickets, and played his last test at age 44 whilst still at the peak of his powers, taking 44 wickets in his last series! He was dropped, perhaps due to his age, for the 1936/37 Ashes. By all rights, he should have played a few more tests before the second world war, but perhaps the selectors looked at his record against England, the only quality opposition of his day. He averaged 29.53 (adjusted from 32.53) in Ashes matches, and was even dropped from the side after three tests of the Bodyline series. O'Reilly on the other hand averaged an adjusted 23.09, which is the main reason why Grimmett ranks below him in this study. Then again, Grimmett still took 93 wickets in 19 matches against England. And he has the 5th best record in overseas conditions of any bowler in history. Therefore, he more than deserves his position in the top 20.

 

[Kirkut]

Ambrose might not be the best of all time but he certainly was the hardest to face for any batsman, even harder than Marshall. I've seen batsmen play shots against Mcgrath on occasions but never seen anyone taking on Ambrose, that steep bounce angling the ball in and no room for shots. He was Joel Garner on steroids.

 

[stephen]

Essentially this debate started because I suggested bringing in McGrath over Imran in a tail that already had Hadlee, Marshall and Warne and dropping Imran down to the second XI which had a tail consisting of Wasim, Steyn, Ambrose and Murali, which would strengthen that tail significantly.

In a different thread I said that picking Murali alongside McGrath and Garner in an ODI side is a mistake since your tail is too long.

And that gets interpreted as "Stephen is super biased".

 

[Burgey]

I think it was your suggestion that Glenn Trimble take Tendulkar's place which probably prompted that allegation

 

[stephen]

Grimmett is one of those bowlers that I wish there was footage of. He's got an exceptional record. I can't believe he was 33 when he debuted!

Does this make him the oldest player to debut on this list? Marshall had retired at that age!

 

[Starfighter]

Grimmett is one of those bowlers that I wish there was footage of. He's got an exceptional record. I can't believe he was 33 when he debuted!

There is. Lots if you know where to look. Turner, Trumble and Lohmann are the only bowlers in the top 100 there isn't at least a little footage of.

 

[Coronis]

Still miffed he was dropped!

 

[stephen]

There is. Lots if you know where to look. Turner, Trumble and Lohmann are the only bowlers in the top 100 there isn't at least a little footage of.

The footage isn't great though. It's even hard going back and watching the old non-hd 4:3 clips on YouTube from the 80s these days tbh.

 

[ankitj]

So I again got my prediction of relative positions of Grimmett and O'Reilly wrong. Grimmett has amazing overall record but relatively ordinary against England which probably mars his legacy a bit. #15 is very close to where I put him on most days.

 

[stephen]

I had Grimmett much higher but have no issues with him being 15.

 

[stephen]

Bearing in mind I was placing the players based on where I thought the algorithm would place them.

 

[Migara]

1 McGrath
2 Marshall
3 Murali
4 Hadlee
5 Steyn
6 Ambrose
7 Imran
8 Barnes
9 Warne
10 Waqar
11 Donald
12 O'Riely
13 Trueman
14 Lillie
15 Grimmet

And on that note, let's get back to the topic at hand.

No.15

Clarrie Grimmett (Australia) 846

Quality Points: 772
Career Points: 74.

Yeah

 

[bagapath]

My prediction

1 Murali
2 Hadlee
3 Marshall
4 Barnes
5 McGrath
6 Warne
7 O'Reilley
8 Lillee
9 Steyn
10 Ambrose
11 Imran
12 Waqar
13 Donald
14 Trueman

 

[Bolo]

A top 20 bowler getting dropped for overseas tests...hmmm

Ha, ridiculous suggestion regarding Ashwin. Rested for dead rubbers only. Law of averages obviously applies to a single series uniformly. He would clearly have been the best bowler on show had he played, but his awesomeness was saved for another day.

Still miffed he was dropped!

He was also dropped on England's previous tour of AUS after taking 5 wickets in 3 games. Clearly he could only be trusted against utter minnows or on outrageous English uncovered stickies.

Ashwin >>> Grimmett confirmed. I demand the ranking system be reviewed such that their placings reflect this self evident truth.

 

[ankitj]

Ambrose might not be the best of all time but he certainly was the hardest to face for any batsman, even harder than Marshall. I've seen batsmen play shots against Mcgrath on occasions but never seen anyone taking on Ambrose, that steep bounce angling the ball in and no room for shots. He was Joel Garner on steroids.

"Curtly was the best opposition bowler I ever faced by far. You were always under pressure with him. Did he bowl a bad over ... ever? A bad ball? A full toss? I'm sure he did, but it never seemed that way when you were facing him"

– Matthew Hayden.

 

[NUFAN]

"Curtly was the best opposition bowler I ever faced by far. You were always under pressure with him. Did he bowl a bad over ... ever? A bad ball? A full toss? I'm sure he did, but it never seemed that way when you were facing him"

– Matthew Hayden.

I love Justin Langer. I almost drown every other year - Matthew Hayden

 

[Days of Grace]

No.14

Fred Trueman (England) 850

Quality Points: 759
Career Points: 91

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4QrIdBG1yM

Career: 1952-1965
Wickets: 307
Gold Performances: 4
8/31 vs. India at Manchester 1952 (17.36)
6/30 vs. Australia at Leeds 1961 (17.23)
6/31 vs. Pakistan at Lord's 1962 (15.41)
7/44 vs. West Indies at Birmingham 1963 (16.84)
Silver Performances: 9
Bronze Performances: 6

Overall Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings: 21.87 (21.58) 43.74 (49.44) 4.91 (rank 13)
50 Innings Peak Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings (1960-1964): 20.29 40.12 5.97 (rank 23)
Non-Home Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings: 25.04 52.62 4.20 (rank 37)
Quality Opposition Average/Strike-Rate/Points Per Innings: 22.06 43.23 5.46 (rank 12)

Not counting Sydney Barnes, Fred Trueman is England's greatest ever fast bowler. From the time he destroyed an intimidated Indian lineup in his debut series until his last Ashes battle in 1964, Trueman should have been one of the first names on the England team-sheet. Unfortunately, he ruffled the feathers of the establishment at times and consequently only played in 67 of England's 120 matches during his career. How many wickets would he have taken if he was selected for even 75% of those matches? He missed many tours but on the other hand this may have preserved his average and outstanding strike-rate, since he was more effective in home conditions. His career strike-rate is the 5th best of alltime.

"T' greatest fast bowler who ever drew breath?" Almost.

Top 10 Best Career Adjusted Strike-rates
1 FH Tyson 40.60
2 Mohammad Abbas 41.96
3 K Rabada 42.09
4 SE Bond 42.84
5 FS Trueman 43.74
6 DW Steyn 43.90
7 Waqar Younis 45.42
8 WW Hall 46.52
9 Shoaib Akhtar 46.73
10 GA Lohmann 46.77

 

[Starfighter]

Second best bowling action ever (after Harold Larwood).

 

[smash84]

My prediction

1 Murali
2 Hadlee
3 Marshall
4 Barnes
5 McGrath
6 Warne
7 O'Reilley
8 Lillee
9 Steyn
10 Ambrose
11 Imran
12 Waqar
13 Donald
14 Trueman

baggers, at least you got number 14 right, good guess

 

[stephen]

Second best bowling action ever (after Harold Larwood).

You misspelt Michael Holding.