Can Steyn test the aussies ?

[Polo23]

That VB series appearance where he took a lot of tap is a pretty poor example. It was one game when he was very young and inexperienced. A long time has passed and he is currently the best test quick going around.

I don't think he's mentally fragile at all..not from what i've seen anyway.

 

[Jono]

Yes.

Based on what? Stereotypes and generalisations of Aussie pitches giving fast bowlers assistance?

http://content-aus.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/332912.html

Reckon Steyn will get a more helpful pitch than that?

 

[Uppercut]

Based on what? Stereotypes and generalisations of Aussie pitches giving fast bowlers assistance?

http://content-aus.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/332912.html

Reckon Steyn will get a more helpful pitch than that?

I'm just going to say that as a general point, not directed at you in particular. That pitch was nowhere near, not remotely close to, as good for fast bowling as the Indian batting lineup made it look. Kumble chose to bat on it, remember.

 

[Top_Cat]

I'm just going to say that as a general point, not directed at you in particular. That pitch was nowhere near, not remotely close to, as good for fast bowling as the Indian batting lineup made it look. Kumble chose to bat on it, remember.

Whilst the above is true, Aussie pitches have been absolutely dead for a few years now. Probably offering less for the bowling than the pitches we're seeing in India right now. Adelaide, Sydney and even Perth have been graveyards.

 

[Richard]

Steyn's wickets

Batsmen 1-3
31.3%
Batsmen 4-7
34.4%
Batsmen 8-11
34.4%

You would expect an opening bowler to take 39/40% of the top order batsmen and about 25/26% of the tail. There won't be much tail wagging for Australia as Morkel also likes the tail (37.5%), but I expect Morkel to get injured at some time during the Tests. Kallis and Ntini to get the majority of the wickets because there won't be the swing and reverse swing that Steyn would be looking for.

Another swing bowler, Hoggard in Australia 45.31.

Kallis is as swing-dependant as Steyn and Hoggard.

 

[Jono]

I'm just going to say that as a general point, not directed at you in particular. That pitch was nowhere near, not remotely close to, as good for fast bowling as the Indian batting lineup made it look. Kumble chose to bat on it, remember.

As TC suggested, whether or not the pitch was as helpful as India all out for 76 suggests, the fact is it offered more than any Australian pitch has in many years. Going back to at least 2002 at a minimum.

 

[Uppercut]

Whilst the above is true, Aussie pitches have been absolutely dead for a few years now. Probably offering less for the bowling than the pitches we're seeing in India right now. Adelaide, Sydney and even Perth have been graveyards.

Yeah, that's definitely true too. I miss the old Perth

 

[Richard]

As TC suggested, whether or not the pitch was as helpful as India all out for 76 suggests, the fact is it offered more than any Australian pitch has in many years. Going back to at least 2002 at a minimum.

I reckon you could make a decent case for there being 1 Australian pitch since 2001/02 that offered anything like as much as that Motera pitch did for the first couple of sessions.

That being the one at The 'Gabba in 2003/04.

 

[popepouri]

Steyn's wickets

Batsmen 1-3
31.3%
Batsmen 4-7
34.4%
Batsmen 8-11
34.4%

Poor stat. When tailenders fall easily to his pace that doesn't mean he can't take wickets up top.

Steyn is interesting. If he's not the right mindset, he gets wayward really easily. When he on key though and he's pitching the ball on a length and swinging away, it's a beautiful sight. It basically comes down to how many wicket taking balls he can bowl.

 

[irfan]

Most of the Aussie RH bats (Ponting, Symonds etc.) struggle with the ball coming in, not the outswinger - which is Steyn's major weapon. Will clean up the tail if he gets the opportunity. Morkel to be the more dangerous seamer if he gets his lines and lengths right.

 

[Top_Cat]

Most of the Aussie RH bats (Ponting, Symonds etc.) struggle with the ball coming in, not the outswinger - which is Steyn's major weapon. Will clean up the tail if he gets the opportunity. Morkel to be the more dangerous seamer if he gets his lines and lengths right.

May be the case against not-so-quick blokes but Shane Bond and Simon Jones always got to the Aussie batsmen. Mind you, if you bowl quick and swing the ball away, you're going to take wickets against anyone. But yeah Steyn's success will depend on how much swing he gets and if there's none, whether he can throttle back a bit.

 

[zaremba]

I expect he'll do well.

But I appreciate that (a) I'm in the minority, and (b) since my predictions are almost always wrong, he's sure to have the worst series in cricket history, surpassing even Harmison in 2004/5

 

[Polo23]

May be the case against not-so-quick blokes but Shane Bond and Simon Jones always got to the Aussie batsmen. Mind you, if you bowl quick and swing the ball away, you're going to take wickets against anyone. But yeah Steyn's success will depend on how much swing he gets and if there's none, whether he can throttle back a bit.

That moreso backs up irfan's point, because Bond is an in-swing bowler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrTbA6igIjw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AIbZfycZI0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB4FnSAPEks

Though, I think any good bowler whether they bowl outswing, inswing, seam, whatever, will trouble any batsmen.

If Steyn struggles in Australia then i'd fully expect guys like Lee, Clark, Johnson to struggle also.

 

[Top_Cat]

That moreso backs up irfan's point, because Bond is an in-swing bowler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrTbA6igIjw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AIbZfycZI0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB4FnSAPEks

Though, I think any good bowler whether they bowl outswing, inswing, seam, whatever, will trouble any batsmen.

If Steyn struggles in Australia then i'd fully expect guys like Lee, Clark, Johnson to struggle also.

Yeah but Shane Bond's success against the Aussie was in how well he bowled out-swing. All bar one of his wickets (Hayden) was with the ball moving from right to left, Martyn and Ponting both caught behind even.

Anyway, Bond did well against Australia not just because he swung the ball at pace but because he just bowled bloody well. All the tools are useless if you don't know how to use them. As far as Steyn goes, the only doubts I have are really his accuracy (consistency) and whether he can pare it back if the pitch or batting demands that he not go balls-out every ball. If he can do that, see no reason why he won't do well.

 

[Polo23]

Bond never bowled out-swing. Occasionally he got the one to hold it's line, but he never genuinely swung the ball away from the righty.

I'm guessing you are talking about the WC effort? There was pretty much no swing involved, just the ball holding it's line, which is what he was doing well in the early part of his career. Most of his wickets vs Australia came from him bowling in-swing.

But yeah, as I said before it doesnt matter what you bowl, if you are a good bowler you will trouble batsmen. Steyn is a good bowler, so I see no reason why he shouldnt trouble Australia.

 

[Top_Cat]

Bond never bowled out-swing. Occasionally he got the one to hold it's line, but he never genuinely swung the ball away from the righty.

I'm guessing you are talking about the WC effort? There was pretty much no swing involved, just the ball holding it's line, which is what he was doing well in the early part of his career. Most of his wickets vs Australia came from him bowling in-swing.

Well, I dispute that there was no swing, just not as much as he can swing the ball in I guess. Outies never go as much anyway, tend to go later so swing less. But the footage here shows pretty clear right-to-left movement in the air, particularly with the Gilchrist (and, for that matter, his famous yorker to Gilly in Adelaide), Martyn (the ball was quite short, if it was up there would have gone away even more) and Harvey dismissals;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnepnNAHiPw

Shane Bond could definitely bowl out-swingers and well enough to take top-level batsmen. He was just predominantly an in-swing bowler. Most importantly, though, he used them both really well. Was great watching him bowl.

 

[Polo23]

I'm still not seeing any movement in the air. He got the ball to pitch then straighten, as i've already said. Movement off the pitch, rather than in the air.

 

[grapedo]

I wasn't suggesting that the bowlers I mentioned had been consistent throughout their careers - merely that when they are bowling well, it comes from consistently hitting a length throughout a match and building pressure rather than bowling the odd peach. There's not a lot of movement in Australia so those who look to pitch it up and swing it tend to get hit around a bit while those who bowl a "good" length consistently enjoy the extra bounce. That was my point.

Well next time say I don't think he will due to the fact at the bottom of your page And Nel adn Ntini aren't even bowling well enough to earn selection at the moment and collymore and dillon don't play anymore so maybe your "facts" should be more in depth and truthful

 

[grapedo]

Two lefty openers is a problem for Steyn. He's far, far better against right handers, as was obvious against England.

Well Ntini has a terrific record agains the australian left handers and taht is why this tour is important for him to bowl well as well.

 

[grapedo]

As TC suggested, whether or not the pitch was as helpful as India all out for 76 suggests, the fact is it offered more than any Australian pitch has in many years. Going back to at least 2002 at a minimum.

I think you guys need to check what south africa made in their first innings of that test the pitch was a road but steyn bowled brilliantly with morkel and they bowled them out for 76.