Better combo round II. Sobers & Marshall vs Sachin and Imran

[govinda indian fan]

Sobers' 27 average with a frontline bowler's production (4WPM) and workload (more overs bowled per match than even Imran did, which is crazy) is better than Imran's 50 average as a lower order bat imo. Sobers was actually doing a proper very good specialist bowler's job at a very high level. Imran's batting though very good was obviously not actually nowhere near as good as the averages suggested. Genuinely don't think their secondary disciplines are that close. Sobers' workload and contribution to the team was on another level.

One point that turns sobers vs imran debate is after 89 imran played as specialist bat but sobers didnt stop bowling till his last match

 

[Johan]

there's literally ZERO logical reasoning behind picking Sachin and Imran here

 

[capt_Luffy]

But is it equivalent to mid to high 30s?

Low 40s for me. Not only the RPI is underwhelming, but the RPM is more so. He just didn't always took the load of a frontline batsman.

 

[Johan]

Low 40s for me. Not only the RPI is underwhelming, but the RPM is more so. He just didn't always took the load of a frontline batsman.

+ He's the ultimate downhill skier, most of his runs are underwhelming with a decent 50 here and there.

 

[capt_Luffy]

+ He's the ultimate downhill skier, most of his runs are underwhelming with a decent 50 here and there.

There I disagree. He has multiple match saving performances with a few match winning ones against almost every team he played. Infact he has a MoTS in India mostly for his batting.

 

[Johan]

There I disagree. He has multiple match saving performances with a few match winning ones against almost every team he played. Infact he has a MoTS in India mostly for his batting.

I mean Yeah he has a good series with the bat, but his ton at the oval, or work in Australia etc are all just completely downhill skiing, I won't really take him over any real low 40s batter if I'm being real.

 

[capt_Luffy]

I mean Yeah he has a good series with the bat, but his ton at the oval, or work in Australia etc are all just completely downhill skiing, I won't really take him over any real low 40s batter if I'm being real.

Yeah that I too probably won't.

 

[Johan]

Yeah that I too probably won't.

reckon I'd take him over Latham at most.

 

[capt_Luffy]

reckon I'd take him over Latham at most.

Over that period surely, overall no.

 

[ankitj]

Low 40s for me. Not only the RPI is underwhelming, but the RPM is more so. He just didn't always took the load of a frontline batsman.

I disagree that a batsman can just boost their average by playing down the order or "low work load" .

Let me ask it this way: with his workload how much would Imran have to average to be considered as good during his peak as Sobers' peak, both in secondary disciplines?

 

[Coronis]

I disagree that a batsman can just boost their average by playing down the order or "low work load" .

Bradman at 5-7
14 innings 1433 @ 119.41 6 tons 2 fifties
Bradman at 3-4
66 innings 5563 @ 95.91 23 tons 11 fifties

Bro needed to bat down the order more

 

[capt_Luffy]

I disagree that a batsman can just boost their average by playing down the order or "low work load" .

Let me ask it this way: with his workload how much would Imran have to average to be considered as good during his peak as Sobers' peak, both in secondary disciplines?

I think fundamentally Imran played in a role he had less load than a genuine top order batsman. Not only his average, his batting just seems to had been an after thought.

 

[shortpitched713]

I think fundamentally Imran played in a role he has less load than a genuine top order batsman. Not only his average, his batting just seems an after thought.

Underutilized sure, but not under-skilled towards the latter part of career. There is a meaningful distinction there.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Underutilized sure, but not under-skilled towards the latter part of career. There is a meaningful distinction there.

I don't rate just skill without output.

 

[shortpitched713]

I don't rate just skill without output.

Well, it balanced out, as he wasn't sitting at positions 8 or 7 anymore, he was the established 6 bat and getting much more significant scores. His bowling output declined and even stopped by the very end when he was a specialist bat, and most likely to get the 80s, 90s, 100 scores.

He was still slightly underutilized at 6. But only because no one expected him to be that damn consistent and effective at the specialist bat role. He was very consistent at making healthy contributions with bat during the 90s, without hitting too many monster scores.