Best of the big 4?

[Bouncer]

Imran! bowler who improved with time, the only bowler who came after a big injury and was able to retain his speed and strike rate. hadlee very good bowler but Imran would beat him if we are considering a bowler to play allover the world (Dont forget Hadlee, Botham And Marshall stepped out of 87 WC for what???)

His Batting: The most relaible among 4, good defence, nice striker of the ball too. To me Kapil was second best in that category beating botham for consistency.

Captaincy: Dont need to say anything.

Another big factor, the influence he had on his players, prefer played with young team and had most aggrasive approach of all 4 when captain.

 

[warrioryohannan]

Imran all the way. Just to give you an idea, Imran aveaged 50 with the bat and just 19:O with the ball in the test matches played in the last ten years of his career.

 

[ajaagarkarajaaja]

Where do you think you will rank Ajit Agarkar as an allrounder? He has not done justice with his batting (though when he gets his act right he is on fire) but as a bowler he has been amazing.

 

[Anil]

Giving 5,4,3,2,1 in order of merit to these five, here is my take on this comparison:

Batting:

Sobers(7...sorry, but he truly was atleast a 7 in terms of batting...)
...........
...........
Imran(4)
Botham(3)
Kapil(2)
Hadlee(1)

Bowling:

Hadlee(5)
Imran(4)
Botham(3)
Kapil(2)
Sobers(1)

Fielding(includes catching):

Botham(5)
Sobers(4)
Kapil(3)
Imran(2)
Hadlee(1)

Overall:

Sobers(12)
Botham(11)
Imran(10)
Kapil(7), Hadlee(7)

Sobers for me tops mainly because of his absolutely superlative batting talents. Botham and Imran are neck-and-neck, but his figures show that Botham was more consistent in all aspects of the game than Imran. Kapil and Hadlee bring up the rear in this illustrious group.

 

[Choora]

Imran improved with age, Bothom went the oposite way. Hadlee was th best bowler of them all, but wasn't that good a batter.

Of them all Imran was the best, and if we consider captaincy too, then its an added plus point for Imran.

 

[BlackCap_Fan]

hadlee was not a bad fielder.I don't disagree with sobers being a 5 for fielding,but hadlee was a good fielder,why he gets a 1 is beyond my knowledge.

 

[ajaagarkarajaaja]

Of them all Imran was the best, and if we consider captaincy too, then its an added plus point for Imran.

As far as captaincy is concerned, the best was Kapil because he won the world cup at a time when it was unthinkable to defeat West Indies!!! Imran won a cup very late for Pakistan.

Bothom was the worse captian of the lot.

 

[Mr. P]

The reason I consider Sobers to be the best cricketer the game has known is because he was a superb batsman, a more than useful bowler and a brilliant fielder.

Bradman was a brilliant fielder himself.

Bradman has an average 40 more than Sobers, which is huge, the gap is massive.

Sobers bowling average of 34 is good, yes, but nothing exceptional.

 

[Craig]

Hadlee could hold a cricket bat in his hands and score quite a few handy fifties with two tons.

According to Ian Botham, his batting (Hadlee) had to something that dropped away because of his fielding ability and having to carry an entire bowling line-up. And perhaps Imran had to do this to an exten in carrying a bowling line-up.

Hadlee was just a great bowler and probably just as good as Imran or marginally better. Either way you have two great cricketers.

I would go with Imran first (more all-round), Hadlee (more to do with the ball) then Kapil Dev and then Botham.

 

[Craig]

Sobers bowling average of 34 is good, yes, but nothing exceptional.

Ah Sobers bowled three different types of bowling style. And was a new ball bowler as well in the 60s.

He was the captain's dream. He gave the captain's he played under lots of options in team line-ups.

 

[iamdavid]

Imran! bowler who improved with time, the only bowler who came after a big injury and was able to retain his speed and strike rate.

Ahem

Lillee , Gillespie (twice) & Bishop , to name but 3.

Where do you think you will rank Ajit Agarkar as an allrounder? He has not done justice with his batting (though when he gets his act right he is on fire) but as a bowler he has been amazing.

He's got the potential to be a better bowler than his record shows but I think his batting technique is a joke , in all honesty I reckon Bothan , Imran Khan , Hadlee , Kapil & Sobers would be quite insulted to learn of his name even being mentioned in this thread

As for 'best of the big 4' , Id have to say Imran Khan for reasons already mentioned.

Botham was equally talented with bat & ball & had the ability to destroy teams single handedly on his day....but he was to inconsistent.
Also a great slipper.

Hadlee was a brilliant bowler for a decade , amazingly accurate , capable of seaming it around & very consistent.
However he has really only a number 7 or 8 at best with the bat , someone who could rescue his team on occasions but was to inconsistent.
Would've struggled to make the side as a batsman alone.

Kapil carried the Indian pace attack for over a decade until Srinath came along , his ability to swing the ball in all conditions , from an overcast Headingley to a bone dry Madras , combined with his control & stamina making him a formidable bowler...considering he played mostly on the subcontinent.
However his batting had the ability to take sides apart in an hour but was to inconsistent.

Imran was a more than capable stroke player in the middle order , possesing all the shots & a sound defence plus the consistency the other 3 must envy.
He would've made the side as a specialist bat & I beleive on one occasion he did.
His bowling was only just below Hadlee's , express pace & the ability to swing the new & old ball both ways making him lethal even at home.
I think for a paceman to play half his cricket in Pakistan & yet take over 300 test wickets at an average of 22 really is something special.
Then there is the captaincy & the great work he did in bringing on youngsters like Inzy , Waqar & Wasim.

For me it was between Imran & Botham as I dont think the other two are genuine allroudners , I dont really think they would've made their respective sides at specialist batsman.

 

[BlackCap_Fan]

Where do you think you will rank Ajit Agarkar as an allrounder? He has not done justice with his batting (though when he gets his act right he is on fire) but as a bowler he has been amazing.

ajit agarkar may be an all rounder(not a good one though)but he doesn't deserve to be in the same thread as any of the "big 4",or Sobers or Bradman.Even considering he is a quarter as good as any of them is insane.

Imran wasn't carrying the bowling,well he might have but not to the extent as Hadlee,although the NZ attack was strong.

 

[Richard]

Most of the stuff has been gone over, methinks...
IMO as far as bowling was concerned it's simple - Hadlee was easily the best, Imran not too far behind, then Botham and Kapil a bit further.
As far as batting was concerned, Imran and Botham were probably about equal - Imran had the better record and Kapil wasn't too far behind. Hadlee's batting was never something that would have earned him a place in the side, unlike the top two quite conceivably.
For me, Imran has to be the best all-rounder, with Botham second. Kapil wasn't a massive way behind, and Hadlee, while a better bowler than the lot of them, wasn't quite as good with the bat so as to compete in the "all-rounder" stakes. Still far better than plenty manage, though.
Botham arguably went on too long, Kapil certainly did but it still enabled him to break Hadlee's record, Imran and Hadlee may have done but it didn't do them too much damage.
Certainly all are a league ahead of the like of Harvey, Flintoff, Agarkar, and basically every all-rounder playing today. With the obvious exception of Kallis and Pollock.

 

[Anil]

hadlee was not a bad fielder.I don't disagree with sobers being a 5 for fielding,but hadlee was a good fielder,why he gets a 1 is beyond my knowledge.

All 5 of them were exceptional fielders, not only Hadlee, but I wanted to rank them, so IMO, this is how they stack up against each other.

 

[tooextracool]

i think imran was the best because to have an avg of 22 bowling half of his matches on those lifeless wickets in pakistan certainly makes him a better bowler than even hadlee in my opinion. his batting wasnt great but still good enough to make him the best of the 4. i would put botham at second because he was equal in both departments, kapil in 3rd and hadlee 4th

 

[Richard]

Imran could exploit wickets others couldn't, but so could Hadlee.
Imran just got the chance to do it more often.

 

[Swervy]

i think imran was the best because to have an avg of 22 bowling half of his matches on those lifeless wickets in pakistan certainly makes him a better bowler than even hadlee in my opinion. his batting wasnt great but still good enough to make him the best of the 4. i would put botham at second because he was equal in both departments, kapil in 3rd and hadlee 4th

i will disagree..Bothams batting was better than Imrans on the whole,especially in those first 5 years of his test career.Imran for say all but his last 6 years or so was considered a decent lower order batsman,his technique developed into something a bit more solid and later on he was a good middle order batsman....dont just look at the averages of over 50 in the last few years...look at how many hundreds he got compared to Botham,that might be a more telling indication.

I will still go with Botham on this one over Imran

 

[Mr. P]

Ah Sobers bowled three different types of bowling style. And was a new ball bowler as well in the 60s.

He was the captain's dream. He gave the captain's he played under lots of options in team line-ups.

Ah Bradman batted like three different men put together. And was the best ever batsman as well in the...ever.

He was the captain's dream. He gave the captain's he played under lots of runs against opponent line-ups.

:P

 

[onemangang]

People who rates Bothom so highly should remember one thing,the guy played most of his matches on green top wickets and shyed away from dusty turf of subcontinent.In contrast Kapil played matches everywhere and proved himself.

Bothom was a good allrounder, but i can't place him higher than 4th on thelist.

 

[BlackCap_Fan]

Richard,Hadlee(or Sir Hadlee )got 2 centuries and 15 fiftys.Surely he has to be part of the All Rounder stakes.

Besides,in the 80's,The NZ pitches weren't too bad.

Hadlee had the ability to swing the ball so much it looked like it was magic (or he was cheating)and with the bat,when you needed him he helped.

He got runs when NZ needed it,but when NZ were cruising he usually had a problem.

Hadlee is not the worst of the 4.Kapil is that for me,because he isn't the best batsmen and not the best bowler.He played 40-odd tests more than hadlee and picked up 3 more wickets.

Botham was good on his day but was too inconsistant.