@Spark can you help?
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Andy Roberts vs Courtney Walsh
- Thread starter DrWolverine
- Start date
Before my time, but I heard heaps of stories about how he inspired the Lillee and Thomson payback
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
Johan
State Vice-Captain
Barrington played from 1958 to mid 1968, he only played a couple matches in 1958
Sobers (1958-1968) — 5387 runs from 86 innings, 73.8 average and 19 hundreds
Barrington (1958 to 1968) — 6754 runs from 128 innings, 59.76 average and 20 hundreds
quite a huge gap between the two
Sobers (1958-1968) — 5387 runs from 86 innings, 73.8 average and 19 hundreds
Barrington (1958 to 1968) — 6754 runs from 128 innings, 59.76 average and 20 hundreds
quite a huge gap between the two
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
Yep, like Sachin, Sobers also suffers heavily from playing from a quite young age.
Chin Music
State Vice-Captain
How much impact would Roberts have had by missing some tests because of WSC?
Same as Lillee. If you look at ICC Rankings both these bowlers are screwed by being absent so their overall rankings dropped significantly. Lillee and Roberts were the standout bowlers of arguably the best players in the World, and their stats didn't count
So who are you comparing him to bowling 150+ consistently, certainly not Walsh?
Johan
State Vice-Captain
General question lol
DrWolverine
U19 Debutant
From next time buddy
Chin Music
State Vice-Captain
That's what I wondered. Roberts is a little before my time, I just understand more his impact of his era rather than remember what he actually did. I'm very sceptical of judging players by either stats alone and I'm a little vexed as to the popularity of using longevity in this forum to assess a player. Surely how good a player was overall is the factor. Walsh was a fine bowler, but I'm not sure I would have ever said he was quite a true great in my humble opinion.
During the latter half of the 1970s Roberts was vying with Lillee for title of best fast bowler. Both had guile to go with their pace and aggression. More so than Thomson or Holding who were faster on their day. Gavaskar rated them equal first, partly for their ability to produce unplayable deliveries with the old ball. Greig confirmed that many Packer players rated Roberts as the best bowler in WSC.
The downside for Roberts was that he could labour on slow pitches, and there were several of those in the Caribbean. He was comprehensively outbowled by Holding on the Oval featherbed of 1976, as were all other bowlers in the match. But that was arguably the greatest exhibition of fast bowling ever seen in England.
Roberts' weakness was Walsh's strength - extracting life out of docile pitches when everyone else had given up. His 13-55 at Wellington in 1995, after West Indies had posted 660-5, rivalled Holding's effort. Walsh's extraordinary thirst for hard work enabled him to take more wickets in county cricket than any overseas fast bowler.
As @Qlder says, folk who saw both in action will favour Roberts, who looked the more complete bowler. It is the familiar generation gap between those who watched the older players and those who mainly use data for their analysis. The older the player, the more they get defined by their numbers.
The downside for Roberts was that he could labour on slow pitches, and there were several of those in the Caribbean. He was comprehensively outbowled by Holding on the Oval featherbed of 1976, as were all other bowlers in the match. But that was arguably the greatest exhibition of fast bowling ever seen in England.
Roberts' weakness was Walsh's strength - extracting life out of docile pitches when everyone else had given up. His 13-55 at Wellington in 1995, after West Indies had posted 660-5, rivalled Holding's effort. Walsh's extraordinary thirst for hard work enabled him to take more wickets in county cricket than any overseas fast bowler.
As @Qlder says, folk who saw both in action will favour Roberts, who looked the more complete bowler. It is the familiar generation gap between those who watched the older players and those who mainly use data for their analysis. The older the player, the more they get defined by their numbers.
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Coronis
International Coach
js I know what I’d prefer
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
Pretty much this. A bowler capable of running through a side in a spicy pitch is Great, but one performing tenuously in featherbeds in more often than not more valuable.
We know, re-write history and ignore all people's knowledge of when they actually saw them play just to make up some meaningless stat that in your mind proves your point?
Coronis
International Coach
Pretty sure that’s exactly the opposite of what I just did.
Really, you bolded Roberts apparent weakness and also bolded Walsh's apparent strength. Pretty clear which way you were leaning
Coronis
International Coach
Based on no stats at all, and actually the peer review, i.e the opposite of what you accused me of.
