A Tribute To Adam Gilchrist

[Swervy]

What I clearly meant was "I'd have wanted to had I been him". Players should retire when they want to; I think Gilchrist would have done best to have wanted to retire at the time I said.

with the benefit of hindsight, we would all find such decisions in life easier to make. If I win the lottery in a months time, next Xmas I could look back and say, 'jeez, I could have stopped working back in January'

 

[Richard]

Never would have held the record for most dismissals by a keeper if he'd done that (retired after the 06/07 Ashes). Obviously Boucher is going to re-take the record, but its still nice to be able to say that when you retired, you held the record.

Yeah, there is that. I don't think that's a particularly important record though TBH, and I reckon had it been me I could easily have done without it.

Plus there's the team things of having him around and how that's helped manage the transition process that's begun and is now continuing. The gap left by him in the dressing room, and in the on-field leadership will probably only become apparent once we take to the field without him.

I think this is so hopelessly overrated. There's always someone to do the "leading", be it Nielsen, Ponting, Hussey or whoever. What happens in the "transition" will happen depending on the calibre of the players coming in, nothing else. If Gilchrist could have continued to perform, his staying on would have been good; if not, it'd have been bad. A clean break, as many players as possible leaving at once, can also be of great benefit.

 

[Swervy]

I didn't actually suggest that. Had it been someone other than Swervy who was involved, I possibly wouldn't even have appeared to suggest it.

so its my fault that you can't communicate your thoughts adequatly?

Please explain that comment!!!

 

[Richard]

with the benefit of hindsight, we would all find such decisions in life easier to make.

It's not just the benefit of hindsight, for the second time. I said all this (Gilchrist should retire; he's not the batsman he once was; it'd be a nice last hurrah and he might well go poorly again next summer; etc.) a year ago. I'm merely reiterating it now.

 

[Swervy]

I think this is so hopelessly overrated.

I am interested in why you think that...could you expand on it?

 

[Richard]

so its my fault that you can't communicate your thoughts adequatly?

Please explain that comment!!!

You're well aware that yourself and myself in the forum = plenty of heated comments. I'm more likely to communicate better and more accurately when not posting in reply to you. That's the facts of the matter. It's not anyone's "fault", just the way things are.

 

[Swervy]

I'm more likely to communicate better and more accurately when not posting in reply to you.

Genuinely interested here....why is that?

 

[Richard]

I am interested in why you think that...could you expand on it?

Well, in so many ways really. It is not a player's job to be performing poorly but "offering something in the dressing-room". He can offer something in the dressing-room without being a player, at the behest of the management if neccessary.

I'm very confident Haddin would have done a better job with the bat and probably gloves than Gilchrist this summer. Therefore, I'd prefer it had Haddin played. If Gilchrist could have offered something to whoever wanted his help, great, let Nielsen ask him to come in and hang around the dressing-room.

But don't keep him in the side if he and the side would do better for him to not be in there.

 

[Prince EWS]

I'm very confident Haddin would have done a better job with the bat and probably gloves than Gilchrist this summer.

For Matt: this is my point. This is what I disagree with and where my criticism of Haddin stems from. He is not a better batsman than Gilchrist at the moment.

 

[Matt79]

@ Rich and Swervy tete-a-tete re posting styles - No-one else here cares, so why don't you guys pursue this on MSN or something, rather than in this thread.

 

[Richard]

Genuinely interested here....why is that?

Because you irritate me, you have polar-opposite views to me in just about everything imaginable about cricket. Hence, I tend to post rather more "uh, FFS, here we go again" when you're involved, rather than carefully considering whether things appear to mean exactly what I mean when thinking them. Look back through our many arguments, you'll see a plentiful pattern in this.

It's just an unfortunate reality.

 

[Richard]

@ Rich and Swervy tete-a-tete re posting styles - No-one else here cares, so why don't you guys pursue this on MSN or something, rather than in this thread.

You have a point TBH, but it's fruitless, as I mentioned, nothing will ever change.

My last word on the matter, don't want to annoy people who don't want this sort of stuff in "tribute" threads.

 

[Richard]

For Matt: this is my point. This is what I disagree with and where my criticism of Haddin stems from. He is not a better batsman than Gilchrist at the moment.

Yeah, and it's something that greatly interests me. I've never seen Haddin bat in the longer form of the game (and only on 5 or 6 occasions max in the shorter form, none in which he's scored many, and several of which were a good few years ago) and know only that he's scored lots and lots of runs in the last, what, 4 seasons?

So you seriously think that Gilchrist is still the best batsman of those who keep wicket in Australia, even if he only averages 26?

 

[Jamee999]

I think that Gilly is still the best keeper-batsman in Australia, if not as good as he once was.

Bloody good player though, has that magical ability that very few sportsmen do, to make you feel like nothing is impossible when they are there, Gilly had it, Warne had it, Sachin has it, and it's incredible to watch.

 

[Matt79]

For Matt: this is my point. This is what I disagree with and where my criticism of Haddin stems from. He is not a better batsman than Gilchrist at the moment.

This season he's scored 217 runs in 8 innings, the bulk of which have come from two innings - he's averaged 21.4 in this series against India. I would think it would be likely that Haddin would have done as well. I also think its likely that Haddin will be a better batsman from this point forward, than Gilly would be if he continued.

 

[pasag]

Re: The comment he should have retired with the others, I don't agree. I didn't like the fact that each of those three didn't get their own personal sendoffs and had he retired with them he would have just been part of the group and probably overshadowed by Warne and maybe McGrath.

 

[Richard]

Yeah that's true, and in many ways it'd have been nice if they'd all retired in separate Tests or something (say, Gilchrist after The WACA, Warne after The MCG, McGrath and Langer after The SCG), impractical and completly OOTQ though that may have been. Certainly think Langer got almost totally overlooked as it was - fortunately he was at the crease when the winning runs were hit, which amplified things a bit.

But there's much to be said for seeing three champions and one good player exit together. If they didn't get enough individual credit, that's the fault of those giving (or not) the credit, and I think those who matter would give them more than enough. I certainly tried to.

 

[Matt79]

Langer was overlooked? How about Martyn? Barely rates a mention whenever people rattle off the names of the retirees from last year.

 

[dontcloseyoureyes]

Wow, absolute ripping last page from Richard here.

Oh wait, it was ****. What a surprise.

 

[Richard]

Langer was overlooked? How about Martyn? Barely rates a mention whenever people rattle off the names of the retirees from last year.

Well Martyn's was so sudden it took everyone by surprise, then he disappeared.

I mean, I never really liked Martyn, nor rated him an exceptional batsman, so that's probably why I overlook him. If I didn't do myself, I'd probably be more outraged that others don't.

I do wonder whether, say Hayden hadn't got lucky like he did at The MCG, whether he mightn't have gone by now too. Knowing his ability to just keep conquering adversity in one way or another though, I actually doubt it.