2nd Test at the MCG, Melbourne, 26 Dec - 30 Dec 2020

[Daemon]

I wasn’t assuming that at all.
Accepting all of what you’ve said, if you can’t bat with some sort of tempo then you ought not be picked. You can’t just be passive and expect to make runs. The game doesn’t work that way. If a bowler knows he won’t be attacked if he drops short, gives you width or over pitches then he may as well already have got you out. Because you aren’t going to damage him.

The young fella who opened tonight played and missed plenty and gave a chance. But when they over pitched or gave him width he went after them. Immediately the bowlers have less margin for error. It’s batsmanship.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/batting/most_runs_career.html?id=12384;type=series

 

[Burgey]

I mean, you look at Oliver Davies just now - intent.

 

[honestbharani]

I do feel they weren’t anywhere near proactive enough with trying to disrupt the bowlers today, especially Ashwin. At a minimum you have to be working those singles better than they were.

See, this is where I feel a bit of nuance is lost in the discussion. Ashwin had no idea how to bowl in Australia in 2011, sure. But in 2015, he was bowling fine. He was let down by the fast bowlers doing **** all which meant he had to be both the wicket taker and the containing bowler. He often started off with long on and deep midwicket in place for guys like Smith and Clarke (in that one test). He has clearly found ways to be a bigger threat as a bowler every time since that tour and the emergence of a really good attack around him has helped too.

So while it is theoretically true that they needed to get more singles and be more proactive, that is like saying India should have just tried to hit a few more boundaries in the second innings in Adelaide. Theoretically yes, it makes sense but its harder to pull off practically. Ash had a mid on and a mid wicket and only had 1 or 2 in the square in the deep. You most likely had to play a rather risky stroke to even pull off a single.

And obviously while it was not you, I find it funny how when Lyon is gifted wickets by batsmen, it is because he set them up but when same happens for Ashwin, its the batsmen's fault, according to a couple of the Aussie posters here.

 

[Burgey]

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/batting/most_runs_career.html?id=12384;type=series

Check out the big brain on this bloke - Pujara struck at 44, Green today at 20. So in order to supposedly disprove what I’m saying, you’re using the example of a bloke who scored twice as fast as he did and batted three spots higher in the order.

 

[Gnske]

I hate Paine. So does DCYE, so I'm clearly in the right

You've never been right before in your life. You hate all the people's cricketers.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Well not as good as 10 years ago but a thoroughly satisfying night of cricket that.

 

[Burgey]

And obviously while it was not you, I find it funny how when Lyon is gifted wickets by batsmen, it is because he set them up but when same happens for Ashwin, its the batsmen's fault, according to a couple of the Aussie posters here

I don’t know who says this tbh because any Australian poster who knows anything about cricket realises finger spinners are the absolute pits, regardless of who they play for

 

[honestbharani]

I wasn’t assuming that at all.
Accepting all of what you’ve said, if you can’t bat with some sort of tempo then you ought not be picked. You can’t just be passive and expect to make runs. The game doesn’t work that way. If a bowler knows he won’t be attacked if he drops short, gives you width or over pitches then he may as well already have got you out. Because you aren’t going to damage him.

The young fella who opened tonight played and missed plenty and gave a chance. But when they over pitched or gave him width he went after them. Immediately the bowlers have less margin for error. It’s batsmanship.

I agree that is what the art of batsmanship is about. I am just saying it may take a bit of time for the kid to figure out what his single or two scoring shot options are, as I feel that is how it is for most young batsmen. They know their boundary shots and they know their defence but the 1s and 2s take time to figure out at this level.

Anyways, that is what I feel at least. Guess, agree to disagree.

 

[honestbharani]

I don’t know who says this tbh because any Australian poster who knows anything about cricket realises finger spinners are the absolute pits, regardless of who they play for

 

[OverratedSanity]

Check out the big brain on this bloke - Pujara struck at 44, Green today at 20. So in order to supposedly disprove what I’m saying, you’re using the example of a bloke who scored twice as fast as he did and batted three spots higher in the order.

Pujara's early innings strike rate was just as slow as Greens. He just had the balls to get through that.

 

[Burgey]

Davies for test number six. Stat

 

[Nintendo]

Davies for test number six. Stat

This.

 

[Spikey]

I don’t know who says this tbh because any Australian poster who knows anything about cricket realises finger spinners are the absolute pits, regardless of who they play for

Somehow, Brad Haddin had a stat that said that Ollie Davies strikes at over 200 against spin in grade cricket, and mate, that's we're talking about

 

[Burgey]

Somehow, Brad Haddin had a stat that said that Ollie Davies strikes at over 200 against spin in grade cricket, and mate, that's we're talking about

That’s precisely how finger spinners should be treated tbh. You know, instead of flicking an effete glance to leg slip, stand up straight and thump it wide of mid on like a ****ing man. It’s embarrassing watching people to get out to spin on real wickets.

Different in lesser countries where they don’t have heavy rollers, but it’s embarrassing when it happens here, whether it’s Lyon, Ashwin or even His Roundness.

 

[Pup Clarke]

Wade's shot was the pits. He'd be such a good guy to have at 5/6 to change the tempo of the innings but he's just not an opener. Just get a proper one in, whether that be Harris or Maddinson or whoever

 

[h_hurricane]

Ashwin has clearly improved as a bowler in Australian conditions now.

First 6 matches : 21 wickets at 54.71
Last 3 matches(including this one) : 14 wickets at 18.21

His overall overseas numbers are also looking very decent now.

30 matches, 119 wickets at 30.21.

 

[Spark]

(whispers quietly: a day like today is when the failure to make glenn maxwell a test fixture stands out)

 

[Burgey]

Well Mad Dog has been doing it for all of a year and now isn’t again, sadly.

 

[OverratedSanity]

The one you've wasted is Khawaja

 

[Burgey]

The one you've wasted is Khawaja

He’s opened about as often as Wade tbh, though he’s certainly better suited to it