TheJediBrah
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Maybe, would only take about 7 years
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2nd greatest living cricketer
- Thread starter Fuller Pilch
- Start date
stephen
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Beautiful set up for the slam dunk there.
ataraxia
International Coach
it was irresistible
downside is I'm now going to be viewed as a TJB multi, which feels... insulting.
stephen
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Poor TJB.it was irresistable
downside is I'm now going to be viewed as a TJB multi, which feels... insulting.
TheJediBrah
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Pap Finn Keighl
International Debutant
At least He was undisputed number 1 of his time than any other bowler in any other era.
Imran was not even best of his era.
Pap Finn Keighl
International Debutant
Hadlee, Steyn, Barnes, Murali.. All 4 ..legitimate GOAT bowler contenders.
Your comment makes no sense.
Burgey
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Now your comment makes no sense
kyear2
International Coach
Nothing to do with the 70's. Davidson, Lindwall, O'Reilly etc... But Barnes was from a different era , a different time all together. There is either very little or absolutely no footage of how he actually bowled, and there was a time where it was a matter of debate if he was even a pacer or spinner.
His record, while good was misleading. And there really needs to be a cutoff somewhere as to how far we go back, where we acknowledge that the game they played isn't the same as the one we played today. Either through ability, technique or more pertinently the level of competition.
For me that occured at some point mid 30's, but I acknowledge for most it goes back further, but surely it shouldn't go back to a point before there's even footage and was only 2 legitimate teams.
Just my 2 cents worth.
_00_deathscar
International Regular
Love our pre 50s batsmen though
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
So no WG Grace too, then? I agree with you. It was a very different game then.
TheJediBrah
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**** no. I reckon he was only good because no one else actually played and he just guilted his mates to come and humour him by playing
Himannv
Hall of Fame Member
If you look at the limited footage of Barnes, there's something slightly off about his follow through for a pace bowler. It's like he's slightly too upright and doesn't bend his back enough to generate the kind of pace we'd see with more modern bowlers. It makes me assume that, while he certainly bowled pace, he wasn't exactly very quick when compared with modern standards, although perhaps quick enough based on the standards of his time. The footage is too fuzzy to see any sort of variations he had, but it certainly seems like he had quite a few based on interviews and reports. There are some parallels drawn with O'Reilly so I think he might be something like a medium-fast bowler with cutters or perhaps he'd bowl the odd delivery with spin here and there. So if we judge him by modern standards, I don't think he'll be completely ineffective or anything like that, but perhaps not as good as the likes of Marshall, McGrath, and Steyn.
Victor Ian
International Coach
Barnes' modes of dismissal. Lots of bowled and lots of caught. Batsmen had no ****ing idea.
Here's Murali for comparison.
And Warne
Bill O'Reilly
We have to factor in that Barnes' has missed a huge amount of wickets for lbw because the laws weren't as tight back then.
In Asia, or any pitch that gripped, he'd be a nightmare.
Edit: truth is I'm just spruiking without really knowing. I'm hoping those of you in the know can run with it.
Test Cricket - Sydney Barnes - How Wickets Obtained Graph
Test Cricket - Barnes, S F - graph showing how wickets obtained (how batsman dismissed)
howstat.com
Here's Murali for comparison.
Test Cricket - Muttiah Muralitharan - How Wickets Obtained Graph
Test Cricket - Muralitharan, M - graph showing how wickets obtained (how batsman dismissed)
www.howstat.com
And Warne
Test Cricket - Shane Warne - How Wickets Obtained Graph
Test Cricket - Warne, S K - graph showing how wickets obtained (how batsman dismissed)
howstat.com
Bill O'Reilly
Test Cricket - William O'Reilly - How Wickets Obtained Graph
Test Cricket - O'Reilly, W J - graph showing how wickets obtained (how batsman dismissed)
www.howstat.com
We have to factor in that Barnes' has missed a huge amount of wickets for lbw because the laws weren't as tight back then.
In Asia, or any pitch that gripped, he'd be a nightmare.
Edit: truth is I'm just spruiking without really knowing. I'm hoping those of you in the know can run with it.
Red_Ink_Squid
Global Moderator
I think it's fair to say that if peak Barnes were magically transported to the modern game there would be far more question marks about how successful he'd be than if the same were done for one of the 80s bowling greats, say. But in terms of being far too good for his contemporaries (which is the more important thing) he's definitely one of the greatest in history.
Himannv
Hall of Fame Member
The graphs made me think he's actually more similar to O'Reilly than to other bowlers so some of the articles and interviews that suggest it seem to be spot on.
Coronis
International Coach
An excellent nickname and a glorious moustache will do that.
Lillian Thomson
Hall of Fame Member
Fred has decent figures, albeit a small number of matches over several years. But if you throw a strop, bowl England out when they only need 80 odd to win, and give rise to one of the most famous sporting trophies in history, you're likely to be remembered in cricketing circles.