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  1. S

    Name an overrated and an underrated cricketer

    You, Sir, know your stuff!: Ambrose: Lillee: FC: List A: Lillee played for Northamptonshire in 1988, Ambrose in 1989, so maybe their paths did cross!
  2. S

    Name an overrated and an underrated cricketer

  3. S

    Name an overrated and an underrated cricketer

  4. S

    Name an overrated and an underrated cricketer

    "re: Lillee and Ambrose, the year Ambrose first toured England (88) Lillee was playing his final FC cricket there. Wouldn’t surprise me if he was there just on that." Thanks! I'll look into that! "Does he say anything about McGrath after he talks about Marshall, Ambrose and Wasim?" Yes (but...
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    Name an overrated and an underrated cricketer

    Luffy, I'm going to take two completely random people (presumably outside CW) to illustrate how one of them overrates Lillee while the other one underrates Hadlee: Dennis Lillee is overrated by Richard Hadlee because Hadlee regards Lillee (his idol) as the best ever (despite recognising that...
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    Rank him : Joel Garner

    Personally, I would rank Garner somewhere between #4 and #9 (depending upon his footwear): from https://www.topendsports.com/sport/cricket/anthropometry-tallest.htm: Given that it's the festive season, as a tribute, we could be calling him Noel Garner! (there's actually a painter out there...
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    Dennis Lillee vs Fred Trueman

    The following clip (bouncer about 30 s in, use Full screen, listen to Benaud's commentary) shows how fast Hadlee could be off the short run when the adrenaline was flowing (he was about a month past 32 here):
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    Dennis Lillee vs Fred Trueman

    Oh, are you talking about how a selfish batsman might negatively affect team performance but that is less likely to happen if the bowler is selfish? I was just saying that those who see Hadlee as being selfish might rate him more harshly as Hadlee would be less likable to them, i.e. their...
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    Dennis Lillee vs Fred Trueman

    Batsmen might also give a bowler a superior rating because of the fear that bowler induces which doesn't necessarily translate into the bowler being that much more effective at getting the batsman out. Conversely, they might downgrade a bowler because that bowler does not induce that fear for...
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    Dennis Lillee vs Fred Trueman

    "Hadlee was a serious and calculating individual: strike three." from https://www.cricketcountry.com/articles/richard-hadlee-a-phenomenon-in-the-pantheon-of-the-greats-28541/: Hadlee was also often perceived as being obsessed with his personal stats and being selfish which does not always...
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    Dennis Lillee vs Fred Trueman

    I've just found an interesting pdf from 2020 on this. It has some different numbers from your post, Peter, no doubt in part because it includes agony inflicted prior to 1 October 1974 and also after 10 March 1995 (to 2020): from http://www.sportstats.com.au/articles/retiringhurt.pdf (which I've...
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    Dennis Lillee vs Fred Trueman

    I would have given you a Love icon, Peter, but I thought it inconsistent with the batsmen suffering pain!
  13. S

    Dennis Lillee vs Fred Trueman

    No, it isn't remotely possible. Only to those suffering flashbacks of crazy thoughts they had more than a decade ago when they harboured doubts of Hadlee being even a top-10 Test bowler: from...
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    Rank him : Joel Garner

    Here are Garner's stats as a support bowler (#3-5): Here are Garner's stats as an opening bowler (#1-2): You can see that as an opening bowler, he became much more attacking with his Econ going up from 2.34 to 2.64 runs/over and his SR going down by nearly 10 balls/wicket from 55.5 to...
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    Rank him : Joel Garner

    Bumrah will soon be joining that last illustrious list:
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    Rank him : Joel Garner

    This was inspired by @Coronis' post above (I worked off his template): I've managed to sneak Garner's batting into the top 10 based on strike rate (at #9, or #8 if one excludes Murali): I've even got Garner up as high as #7 (#6 excluding Murali) but tragically, it's to do with ducks made:
  17. S

    Brian Lara vs Kumar Sangakkara

    Yes, here! Thanks!
  18. S

    Brian Lara vs Kumar Sangakkara

    This is an interesting article which @kyear2 (if he hasn't seen it before) might enjoy. I haven't read it in any detail (I might later) but this caught my eye:
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    100 Greatest Cricketers by Benedict Bermange (Sky Sports)

    I'm thinking that maybe he was the author because it does seem a rather Strange list. Some posters here feel that it's a betrayal of non-English cricketers so maybe it was made up by Benedict Arnold. The list has W.G. Grace as #1 and I haven't been able to find out whether he was Catholic or...
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    Brian Lara vs Kumar Sangakkara

    Firstly, because Barry Richards has the 12th highest Test batting average of all time: while Mike Procter has only the 61st lowest Test bowling average of all time: Secondly, Procter with 41 wickets in 7 Tests has a worse WPM than Imran in the WI where Imran took 48 wickets in 8 Tests (as...

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