DrWolverine
U19 Debutant
Wasim Akram played with an inferior team?
He played 104 Tests.
84 with Waqar.
52 with Mushtaq.
48 with Saqlain.
44 with Qadir.
38 with Imran.
28 with Shoaib.
4 of those are great or very good.
2 of them were good.
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Jasprit Bumrah vs Malcolm Marshall
- Thread starter Darkshadows
- Start date
He played 104 Tests.
84 with Waqar.
52 with Mushtaq.
48 with Saqlain.
44 with Qadir.
38 with Imran.
28 with Shoaib.
4 of those are great or very good.
2 of them were good.
kyear2
International Coach
Best to just ignore the nonsense that PFK posts.
sayon basak
International Debutant
Or maybe not.
HouHsiaoHsien
International Debutant
On the topic, i would take Marshall ahead on his destructiveness(ala his 1983 India series). I would like Bumrah to have a series like that
DrWolverine
U19 Debutant
The minimum criteria for any bowler in my opinion post-1970 : 50 Tests or 200 wickets
He is yet to achieve either of those so far
HouHsiaoHsien
International Debutant
Yes but even if we were to exclude longevity, I would take Marshall
DrWolverine
U19 Debutant
Regarding Marshall
Does have any flaws his record?
Does have any flaws his record?
DrWolverine
U19 Debutant
Is there any bowler that has like a perfect record? Playing against/in 3 or 4 countries don’t really count.
I mean an overall great average, great strike rate and sub 25 average against & in every country.
I mean an overall great average, great strike rate and sub 25 average against & in every country.
Johan
State Vice-Captain
OverratedSanity
Request Your Custom Title Now!
Not really. Probably just that he had a shorter career than some other ATG bowlers.
HouHsiaoHsien
International Debutant
Plus he didn’t facing strong batting lineups like Steyn, Hadlee or even McGrath
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
I do think it's one of the reasons he has prettier numbers for checklist freaks though - a bigger percentage of his career was "peak" without a "picked too early on potential" phase or the "played on beyond his best because he was still better than a mediocre second change bowler from domestic cricket" phase that can often make someone's record in X country look worse than it deserves.
(And yes, a bigger reason for it was that was one of the very best and most adaptable bowlers of all time, but I still think the above is at least a minor factor)
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
Once Bumrah gets 300 wickets will compare with the ATGs
PlayerComparisons
International Vice-Captain
What if he retires with 275 wickets?
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
Then he will be demerited for not enough of a career sample or length.
He will go down as a normal great/ATVG like Garner who could have been ATG.
I believe in putting stricter standards for those given that ATG bowler title.
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
The reasoning is simple.
If Wasim retired once he reached 300 wickets, would likely have been rated several places higher than when he eventually retired. Same with Imran in 1988.
DrWolverine
U19 Debutant
81 matches was good especially for someone who retired in 1991.
Hadlee : 86 Tests.
Imran : 88 Tests
Donald : 72 Tests
Steyn : 93 Tests
Ambrose : 98 Tests
The other greats played similar amount of Tests
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
To me it's not just tests, I think you need well over a decade in the game to be proven in it, which Marshall was.
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
Marshall's career was much shorter than Imran and Hadlee in terms of years. Number of games is highly dependent on how many your team plays. Marshall played from 78-91, but really was a regular only from 83 onwards. So prime stuff of his international career was over a span of 8 years, which is kinda short when compared to other ATGs like McGrath and Hadlee.