Apex Predator
State Vice-Captain
Astro turfs kinda killed Asian Hockey & both India and Pak were affected.
India have recovered very well & now are among Top 3-4 field hockey sides as for Pakistan it is has been steep unending decline
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*Official* Bangladesh Tour of Pakistan- Test Series
- Thread starter AndyZaltzHair
- Start date
India have recovered very well & now are among Top 3-4 field hockey sides as for Pakistan it is has been steep unending decline
PaulLennon
U19 Vice-Captain
Pakistan do well when a sport is semi-professional but once it becomes a professional sport with match ups, analytics, fitness regimens etc they fall behind cause at that point it's a money game.
ashley bach
Cricketer Of The Year
Pakistan will be back, it might be a number of years away, but they'll be back. Their history and passion for the game can't be ignored.
If administration can be sorted out and a couple of super stars come through it'll be a totally new ball game again.
If administration can be sorted out and a couple of super stars come through it'll be a totally new ball game again.
PaulLennon
U19 Vice-Captain
Being back is relative to other countries.
Their entire country is collapsing economically and politically.
Back during their glory days in the 80s SA did not play, India were poor and sucked, SL/Bang were minnows.
I don't see them overtaking Ind, Eng, Aus, Ban, SA etc anytime soon. Maybe can be better than SL, NZ etc as these countries have lower populations and rely on golden generations. Their upper limit is a mid-tier team.
Silver Silva
International Regular
Bangladesh is rising , and Nepal will also be a major force soon , and Afghanistan has made rapid progress in cricket.
Pakistan can no longer assume they are second best in Asia
PaulLennon
U19 Vice-Captain
Yeah.
And especially in T20 where they are locked out of IPL and its riches.
In 15-20 years IPL will become the main form of cricket and if Pak players still aren't in it, their downfall will be more.
Silver Silva
International Regular
Feel like Pakistan need to swallow the pride and realise the isolation from India in terms of cricketing relations is hurting Pakistan cricket more than anything, that fearsome rivalry used to be motivation in itself to be the best ..
Now it's just a fixed group match.
PaulLennon
U19 Vice-Captain
For that to happen the Pakistani establishment has to realize that they can't "compete" with India. It is impossible to compete against an economy 12x your size.
Accept a deal on the LOC - make it an international border and then decrease military budget and enjoy access to India. Their actors/musicians can work in Bollywood (same language), they can access Indian educational institutes/hospitals/jobs, cricket etc.
No shame in having a hegemony. Canadians are okay with that relationship with the US.
Justin Bieber, Drake, The Weeknd etc - Imagine their careers without access to the American market.
Other South Asian countries might have issues with India (which will obviously arise because of how big India is) but they are still relatively friendly and benefit from Indian largess.
andruid
Cricketer Of The Year
Indeed the world is crying out for a full on India v. Pakistan test match series.
Shri
Mr. Glass
LangleyburyCCPlayer
State 12th Man
Bangladesh fans, is beating Pakistan a bigger deal than beating England, India or Australia (not in terms of quality, but in terms of historical significance and what it means to people)
Aritro
International Regular
It's bigger because it's an away series win away from home. The historical significance of it isn't really a factor in the way that you might imagine. It's been a very long time since the war and the Bangladeshi population don't hold any more enmity towards Pakistan in 2024 than Australians did towards Japan in 1998, even if the war itself dominates our history books and our sense of our past. My family personally saw some pretty horrible **** but they're not celebrating the win in those terms really.
Totally understand what you’re saying, but as I’m sure you well know, there’s a cricketing angle to the history as well. Kimber did a podcast on it. When Bangladesh was East Pakistan, Bangla cricketers were discriminated against on an apartheid like basis. At best, there was one Bangla cricketer for Dhaka tests and a broad cultural view that West Pakistanis were the “martial races” and Bangladesh were for want of a better term, “girly men”. So leaving aside the dark and violent history of 1971 and before, it’s pretty significant in the context of cricketing history.
Spark
Global Moderator
People don't realise how rapidly these historical "memories" can fade, especially in fast-growing countries with young populations. It took like 30 years for Vietnam to flip from being "literally at war with America" to "in some polling, the most pro-American country on the planet".
GoodAreasShane
Cricketer Of The Year
Little late to the party, but I must say I have enjoyed what I have seen of Nahid Rana's work a lot. Still definitely a work in progress, but he does have a bit about him
Injuries permitting of course, bit going on in that bowling action
Injuries permitting of course, bit going on in that bowling action
Starfighter
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
So where to now for Pakistan? Firstly, the team overall displayed the flakiness that cost them heavily in Australia, but perhaps even more so. Can anyone else here think of a mentally weaker team?
Their bowling is a concern as they don't have someone with real pace and Shaheen's being off the boil removes amount of quality. I doubt Abrar will be effective unless the pitches are dry enough that the pacers will be ineffective. I like Khurram and think he could be a useful bowler in the Siddle mould, except I have doubts about his fitness. But they have no-one with real spark who can lift the team. The batting's the biggest problem. Obviously there's a wide gap between QeA and tests - though it's silly how bad they are at playing pace when until Imran's reorganisation greentops were very common. They have guys who can score, but they seem to lack discipline and application, as was starkly apparent in Australia with collapses against spells which might have gone wicketless with even a modicum of judgement. And of course the fielding is plumbing new depths.
Despite the obvious massive structural weaknesses in Pakistan cricket more widely, I honestly don't think they're that bad on paper. But when it comes to getting on the field, eleven headless chickens would be a more resilient team (and could probably catch better). If England don't mince them in every test I will be quite surprised.
Their bowling is a concern as they don't have someone with real pace and Shaheen's being off the boil removes amount of quality. I doubt Abrar will be effective unless the pitches are dry enough that the pacers will be ineffective. I like Khurram and think he could be a useful bowler in the Siddle mould, except I have doubts about his fitness. But they have no-one with real spark who can lift the team. The batting's the biggest problem. Obviously there's a wide gap between QeA and tests - though it's silly how bad they are at playing pace when until Imran's reorganisation greentops were very common. They have guys who can score, but they seem to lack discipline and application, as was starkly apparent in Australia with collapses against spells which might have gone wicketless with even a modicum of judgement. And of course the fielding is plumbing new depths.
Despite the obvious massive structural weaknesses in Pakistan cricket more widely, I honestly don't think they're that bad on paper. But when it comes to getting on the field, eleven headless chickens would be a more resilient team (and could probably catch better). If England don't mince them in every test I will be quite surprised.
Very interesting action, all arms. Must say it strikes me as being one that'll be vulnerable to injuries but until he actually gets one may as well not worry about, it's not exactly easy to completely rebuild an action.
AndyZaltzHair
Hall of Fame Member
I agree with this
I'd like to add that previous government would have specifically highlighted the war thing if they were in power to push their own agenda. For me its a special series win purely from cricketing sense. And for most of population in bd, its the same I'd imagine. For those who dont know, you would be surprised that Pakistan cricket team got a huge fan base in bd. I myself witnessed it in stadiums whenever they played here. Girls regularly used to bring placards written "Afridi marry me". But I also get what ma1978 said. The war was hard fought and many still living carrying that past. So if someone wants to look at it from that perspective without meaning any harm and get their happiness from a game, I don't have any issue with that.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
This.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
Pak did it to us. 26/6 is basically a test winning score tbh.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
This is an interesting point. I remember we often used to wonder why Pak always seemed to do well in England and NZ but not so much in Aus. India were the opposite. Maybe this is the reason, they are just used to handling seam movement and swing better.
Also, I know Shaheen is ahead now but I honestly believe Naseem Shah is better and is easily their most important bowler going forward for the next 10 years.