I mean, you could say the same about AndersonNah. From what I hear Bari was a good keeper but I saw a lot of Boucher and he was mid at best. He was just fortunate that SA didn't have anyone better for his whole career.
We did a top 25 allrounders vote in 2022.A voting thread for all rounders after this would be fun
With Flower about to become the 14th best WK of all-time I think it's safe to say this Poll has run its courseDo members want this poll extended beyond a Top 15?
You have been setting the ATG XIs in the other thread using the polls. In that case, 70:30 in favor of keeping will not be ok for me since I would rather have a Pant instead of Saha in my ATG XI. The keeper usually bats at 7 and I want my No 7 batsman to be really good.From the outset I hoped that voters wouldn't overly look at batting ability. I suggested a 70/30 keeping/batting ratio be considered. Without being too critical of voters, some appear to have adopted a 30/70 ratio.
Since WWII there has been less emphasis on purist keepers and more on keeper/batsmen with Knott being the trend-setter in this regard. Since then selectors, and spectators, have been accepting of batsmen/keepers whose keeping skills are basic, and in some cases barely adequate.
Having said that, keepers such as Gilchrist, Healy and Knott have been excellent/very good keepers and richly deserve their high rankings. Unfortunately, highly skilled keepers such as Tallon, Evans and Russell have often been overlooked. Fortunately the well documented skills of Oldfield saw him ranked in our poll.
Just get one of them to fake an injury and have bothsince I would rather have a Pant instead of Saha in my ATG XI
I think with how many keepers are looking to miss out and getting a lot of votes, this poll should be extended to Top 20.Do members want this poll extended beyond a Top 15? We have 60 in both bowlers and batsmen polls but teams include multiple players in both categories but only one designated keeper.
How can bating be a main criteria for a specialist position that doesn't include batting though.
Sorry to bring this back up, but I'm presuming given your lack of answer to this that it isn't a genuine belief and was just some throwaway comment. That does not an argument make.Without meaning to sound sarky (that isn't my intention): is this a genuine belief of yours?
It is a genuine belief. I would prefer if they didn't average 15, but the notion that you just go with that better batsman is antithetical to purpose of the position.Sorry to bring this back up, but I'm presuming given your lack of answer to this that it isn't a genuine belief and was just some throwaway comment. That does not an argument make.
You're trying to be pedantic. All I'm saying is that your actually wicketkeeping skills should have some priority in the selection.In that case, why is 50/50 this all-important splitting point for you? Couldn't it just as well be 48/52 or 45/55? To me, 51% keeping, 49% batting being A-OK while 49% keeping, 51% batting isn't solely due to an important number occurring between those two values is illogical. Especially when we've seen that over time the pressure to bat put on a wicket-keeper has grown, from no requirement to requiring almost the same ability as a specialist #5/6 bat in some parts of the world – what is the basis for all this improvement having a set cap at 50/50?
I'm lost.Well **** mate if it wasn't a genuine belief then why didn't you say so the two times of asking?
But it can be overbearingly deciding. Andy Flower makes more impact for a median team than Ian Healy.I'm lost.
Batting can't be the primary consideration when selecting a wicketkeeper.
Yes it is a factor, way more so than for a bowling attack, but can't be the primary one.
For the catcher in baseball, batting is the primary factor. Obviously wicketkeepers have a greater role than catchers, but it's still an example of a specialist position for which batting is more important.I'm lost.
Batting can't be the primary consideration when selecting a wicketkeeper.
Yes it is a factor, way more so than for a bowling attack, but can't be the primary one.
Who are you selection, Flower or Knott?But it can be overbearingly deciding. Andy Flower makes more impact for a median team than Ian Healy.
Having Don Tallon ahead of Dhoni is just stupid.
Depends on the team. Closer, because Knott knows how to hold a bat and was more than exceptional while Flower was capable at best. In a rank Turner for a strong team, I would take Knott while in a flat or fast pitch for a median or weak team, I would take Flower.Who are you selection, Flower or Knott?
If the team is that weak just play Flower as a batsman and let the real keeper hold the gloves.Depends on the team. Closer, because Knott knows how to hold a bat and was more than exceptional while Flower was capable at best. In a rank Turner for a strong team, I would take Knott while in a flat or fast pitch for a median or weak team, I would take Flower.