Debate thread for 2024 Ranking of batsmen poll

[kyear2]

I bring out all the anti-Smith arguments but the fundamental point of difference is that I think he has clearly accomplished enough before the dip began to considered in the highest echelon if Tendulkar, Hobbs, etc. His dip for me will just end him at the lower end of that but he has marked himself already higher than Lara, etc.

Can't help but think there is a lot of revisionism now on CW about Lara too.

You need to stop saying you're a fan of Lara's.

 

[capt_Luffy]

You’re missing the point completely. The point from me was that I give Headley credit for his pre war exploits, but not for his supposed longevity.

Hobbs and Hutton also missed large chunks of their prime due to the wars, I don’t increase their rating based on “missed large chunks of prime”

I was just commenting on Howitzer's comment.

 

[howitzer]

But what about who missed their best years due to the War? Like Compton, Woolley or Merchant?

Cowie

Yeah they all get a pass too. Less sure on Hassett; he didn't perform before the war in Tests. Would need it demonstrated he was outstanding in higher quality FC games during the war to include him.

 

[subshakerz]

You need to stop saying you're a fan of Lara's.

There is a difference between being a fan and being a fanboy. Some of you all need to learn it.

 

[Prince EWS]

Cowie

Chris Harris

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Chris Harris

Martin Donnelly was another one. Was described by CB Fry as the finest lefthander he'd ever seen.

Donnelly, like Harris, was also a gun fielder. Probably better than Jonty.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Martin Donnelly was another one. Was actually described by CB Fry as the finest lefthander he'd ever seen.

Donnelly, like Harris, was also a gun fielder. Probably better than Jonty.

But not as good as Mahanama

 

[Prince EWS]

But not as good as Mahanama

Or Young Murali.

 

[kyear2]

There is a difference between being a fan and being a fanboy. Some of you all need to learn it.

You put him down as most as much as Ambrose and Kallis.

 

[Victor Ian]

But not as good as Mahanama

Do they still do music when coming out to bat? I'd love him to do the Muppets song

 

[subshakerz]

You put him down as most as much as Ambrose and Kallis.

Merely a course correction in Lara's case. I have him at no.7 in my rankings after all.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

But not as good as Mahanama

Do they still do music when coming out to bat? I'd love him to do the Muppets song

I remember one SL tour out here when Maharoof must've done something good and the late great Martin Crowe in comms came out with (half singing) "Maharoof, Maharoof, Maharoof is on fire".

 

[ma1978]

Merely a course correction in Lara's case. I have him at no.7 in my rankings after all.

So a difference of 1?

 

[subshakerz]

So a difference of 1?

Yup. Doesn't make me anti Lara.

 

[ma1978]

Yup. Doesn't make me anti Lara.

the vehemence of your posting suggests otherwise

 

[centurymaker]

Kallis' Home Record-




At home he's destroyed weaker attacks from WI, India, Bangladesh as expected. And has done really well against Eng at home but has equally struggled against Australian bowlers, averaging 33.

 

[subshakerz]

the vehemence of your posting suggests otherwise

Not really. I am just against mythologizing.

 

[subshakerz]

Kallis' Home Record-

View attachment 39898


At home he's destroyed weaker attacks from WI, India, Bangladesh as expected. And has done really well against Eng at home but has equally struggled against Australian bowlers, averaging 33.

I still think Kallis deserves overall credit for his home record as he exceeds other SA bats, but not the slam dunk argument it is often presented as.

 

[Bolo.]

Kallis' Home Record-

View attachment 39898


At home he's destroyed weaker attacks from WI, India, Bangladesh as expected. And has done really well against Eng at home but has equally struggled against Australian bowlers, averaging 33.

I only agree with the Aus and Bangladesh assessments here.

His first WI series (nearly half his matches) were against peak Walsh, and Ambrose (who might have been past his peak), who had just come off what might be his strongest series statistically ever.

India had weak attacks, but they always had someone going completely nuts in RSA and bowling like an ATG.

England's bowling was usually pretty mediocre in RSA.

 

[Kenneth Viljoen]

Kallis' Home Record-

View attachment 39898


At home he's destroyed weaker attacks from WI, India, Bangladesh as expected. And has done really well against Eng at home but has equally struggled against Australian bowlers, averaging 33.

West Indies didn't always have a weak attack , in 98 they had Walsh & Ambrose and Kallis was brilliant in that series averaging 69 ..

And yes he did struggle against some great Australian bowling but he averaged 48 in Australia so it's not like he was unable to score runs against Aussie attacks ..

And also there were some inspired bowling performances from India in Kallis time ..
It wasn't always one way traffic ..

For example Sreesanth's performance in 2006/7 is one of the greatest performances by a touring bowler to this country in the 21st century which these stats won't show you , Zaheer Khan also troubled our batting line up many a time.