Sachin Tendulkar vs Richard Hadlee

[kyear2]

I rate Viv and Tendulkar highly, but imo it's just impossible to make valid arguments for them being greater than Imran. Marshall> Hadlee/Imran is kinda dubious too but less so.

The top 7 I'm pretty firm on, so Sachin wasn't one that I'm shaky on.

I found it difficult to rank players from different disciplines (as I've said) so I came up with a process to help. I have 7 players I rate in the top tier of those disciplines, so they go into the top tier.
Bradman
Tendulkar
Sobers
Hobbs

Marshall
McGrath
Hadlee.

Don't think anyone has any issues with those orders. If you aren't top tier in your primary discipline how can you be in the top overall?

Viv is the next batsman in line, Steyn the next bowler. Really I also have both spinners and Ambrose ahead of Imran, but urs close enough to factor in the batting, though Warne also contributed with that bat, so it's close between those two for the 10th spot.

Nothing as a slight to anyone, tried / trying to come up with a consistent way to rate the players.

 

[kyear2]

It's cool, I get it. Marshall being the no.1 bowler gives him a 30 plus batting average.

This is why I avoid certain topics, gets personal in a hurry.

In my tiers of bowlers

Marshall
McGrath
Hadlee

Steyn
Warne
Muralitharan
Ambrose

Imran
Donald
Lillee

That's my top 10. I'm not jumping two tiers based on primary skills to include someone who could bat, by that same logic, Kallis is also top 5. I'm not rating all-rounder, there also no Miller.

I'm weighting primary skill 1st and everything thing else are tier breakers.

Remove the names and it makes sense.

 

[kyear2]

1. Bradman
2. Sobers
3. Imran
4. Hadlee
5. Hobbs
6. Marshall
7. Murali
8. Tendulkar
9. Miller
10. McGrath
11. Warne
12. Kallis
13. Steyn
14. Viv
15. Hutton

Like for your list, I have McGrath as the 2nd best bowler ever, I personally don't see how Miller whines neither a great batsman or bowler can be ahead of him, or how he can be so low.

Just different methodologies.

 

[subshakerz]

This is why I avoid certain topics, gets personal in a hurry.

Come on man, that was light ribbing. Take no offense as none intended.

 

[BazBall21]

For his mountainous first class work, I could have bumped Hobbs up a couple of places. It was part of his era transcendence.

 

[kyear2]

For his mountainous first class work, I could have bumped Hobbs up a couple of places. It was part of his era transcendence.

Hence why for me he's 4.

 

[BazBall21]

Hence why for me he's 4.

Yeah he can be anywhere after Bradman/Sobers. I've just always had Tenudlkar as my #2 batsman and I rate him a bit below Marshall and McGrath. Depends on the weighting for Hobbs' FC feats. Hobbs and Tenudlkar had a transcending status on their eras and outstanding longevity.

 

[kyear2]

Yeah he can be anywhere after Bradman/Sobers. I've just always had Tenudlkar as my #2 batsman and I rate him a bit below Marshall and McGrath. Depends on the weighting for Hobbs' FC feats. Hobbs and Tenudlkar had a transcending status on their eras and outstanding longevity.

And they are all in the top 7.

 

[ankitj]

But hey it's your criteria.

Can you say that once more? It's music to ears

 

[ankitj]

It's cool, I get it. Marshall being the no.1 bowler gives him a 30 plus batting average.

I spoke too soon.

 

[Coronis]

8. Viv
9. Steyn
10. Imran

Just causes more questions and barbs.

Was this my cue?

Brah Viv ain’t even a top 10 batsman let alone a top 10 cricketer!

 

[kyear2]

Was this my cue?

Brah Viv ain’t even a top 10 batsman let alone a top 10 cricketer!

From Subs for having Imran so low.

 

[Aidan11]

Thought Sachin would win this.

 

[kyear2]

Did Hadlee bowl reverse?

 

[shortpitched713]

Here's my top 15 modern cricketers:

All rounder aside, I would be interested to see your ranking of greatest cricketers ever

Here's my rough go at it looking at player value, only including post-war players and skewed towards more modern ones I know more about.

Imran
McGrath
S Pollock
Murali
Hadlee

Steyn
Ambrose
Marshall
Donald
Miller
Garner
Ashwin
Philander
Wasim
Warne

Top 5 very clearly separate themselves from the pack though, in my mind.

 

[thierry henry]

I know that asking for the summary of a consensus that doesn't exist is ridiculous, but...can someone give me the ELI5 on why Hadlee is generally one of 3 or 4 bowlers who gets elevated out of the rather larger pool of bowlers with similar-ish records?

As a biased K1W1 I've always loved the fact that he is, but never been entirely sure of the rationale. I can think of a few arguments against - took so many bags because teammates sucked, bowled in favourable NZ conditions, cashed in against historically weak Australian team etc

 

[Coronis]

Here's my top 15 modern cricketers:

You heard it here first, Shaun Pollock clearly seperates himself from Keith Miller as a cricketer.

He’s also apparently above Hadlee too.

 

[Coronis]

I know that asking for the summary of a consensus that doesn't exist is ridiculous, but...can someone give me the ELI5 on why Hadlee is generally one of 3 or 4 bowlers who gets elevated out of the rather larger pool of bowlers with similar-ish records?

As a biased K1W1 I've always loved the fact that he is, but never been entirely sure of the rationale. I can think of a few arguments against - took so many bags because teammates sucked, bowled in favourable NZ conditions, cashed in against historically weak Australian team etc

Home: 43 matches 75 innings 201 @ 22.96, 15 5’fers 3 10’fers
Away: 43 matches 75 innings 230 @ 21.72 21 5’fers 6 10’fers

sidenote: how cool is it that he has a perfect home/away split?

 

[centurymaker]

Did Hadlee bowl reverse?

Good question. Does anyone know?

 

[thierry henry]

Home: 43 matches 75 innings 201 @ 22.96, 15 5’fers 3 10’fers
Away: 43 matches 75 innings 230 @ 21.72 21 5’fers 6 10’fers

sidenote: how cool is it that he has a perfect home/away split?

If the point is he did well away, doesn't it equally say he underperformed at home?

If the point is NZ conditions weren't good for seam bowling, you'd need to look at other bowlers right?