He moved to England as a child and was developed through Durham's system.
Yes he is from Kiwi stock but he didn't come as fully formed cricketer.
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Mitchell Marsh
- Thread starter Ali TT
- Start date
Yes he is from Kiwi stock but he didn't come as fully formed cricketer.
Just a word on the Lillee argument as someone who saw a bit of him in the early 80-'s and a bit of him in the late 70's on TV.
I'd rate McGrath above him but not by much.
But Lillee, as much as I disliked him, is in a different league to the likes of Southee and Hoggard.
I'd rate McGrath above him but not by much.
But Lillee, as much as I disliked him, is in a different league to the likes of Southee and Hoggard.
Probably because specsavers wasn't around back then ?
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
ShadabLots of flashes in the pan but no standouts. Common theme.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Yeah - a lower one.
Some opinions of Lillee from within the game:
Best bowler faced: Botham, Gower, Keith Fletcher, Gavaskar (joint first with Roberts)
Best fast bowler ever: Dickie Bird, Everton Weekes, Peter Pollock, Malcolm Marshall
Best fast bowler seen: Christopher Martin-Jenkins (later placed him third behind Marshall and McGrath).
Best fast bowler of his time: Imran
In Wisden's poll of the greatest cricketers of the twentieth century, Lillee finished joint sixth, receiving more votes than any bowler apart from Warne.
In 2009 ten Australian journalists selected an All-Time Australian XI for Cricinfo. All ten picked Lillee. Five chose McGrath. A panel of former captains and writers then chose a World XI. Lillee secured most votes among fast bowlers.
Lillee may have been rated higher in England than Australia. The opposite seems to be true of McGrath who was sometimes portrayed by the English media as Warne's supporting act.
Best bowler faced: Botham, Gower, Keith Fletcher, Gavaskar (joint first with Roberts)
Best fast bowler ever: Dickie Bird, Everton Weekes, Peter Pollock, Malcolm Marshall
Best fast bowler seen: Christopher Martin-Jenkins (later placed him third behind Marshall and McGrath).
Best fast bowler of his time: Imran
In Wisden's poll of the greatest cricketers of the twentieth century, Lillee finished joint sixth, receiving more votes than any bowler apart from Warne.
In 2009 ten Australian journalists selected an All-Time Australian XI for Cricinfo. All ten picked Lillee. Five chose McGrath. A panel of former captains and writers then chose a World XI. Lillee secured most votes among fast bowlers.
Lillee may have been rated higher in England than Australia. The opposite seems to be true of McGrath who was sometimes portrayed by the English media as Warne's supporting act.
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You've lost all credibility if you think Lillee is a league below Hoggard and Southee, why should anyone listen to anything you say after you put that on the record lol
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Prince EWS
Global Moderator
It's alright, if everyone hates me because my posts are terrible I can always just take a few months off and then come back under a new username, like NSWer or something.
ashley bach
Cricketer Of The Year
I know Dennis wasn't a favourite of yours for whatever reason, but actually unsure if you're joking here because imo Lillee was on a different level
to these two fellas. We can settle it with a large wager though if you'd like by making comparison threads.
Nathan Astle ate Hoggard for breakfast to the point where he was renamed Matthew Floggard.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
I'm definitely taking this piss a bit but I'm not sure how we could resolve it for a wager even if I wasn't. Not even my in-jest opinion was ever "CW thinks Lillee is better than Hoggard" - a comparison thread proves nothing other than what the majority opinion is here.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
Weak from PEWS here. @Fuller Pilch will definitely prove Southee > Lillee
ashley bach
Cricketer Of The Year
Expect a long post from @Fuller Pilch anytime soon.
So you as a moderator are being a troll accusing me of something. What a **** site when that happens, I'm out
Lillee is much better than McGrath, get over it
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Spark
Global Moderator
He's just having a lend mate
Burgey
Request Your Custom Title Now!
This is the take of someone who’s suffering heat stroke
Lillee is without question a genuinely great bowler.
He was very quick when he was younger.
As he got a little older, he was still plenty quick enough but had great control of the ball and regularly found the seam.
His action was a thing of beauty, as pleasing to the eye as any bowler I've ever seen.
And I'm saying this as an Englishman who hated him in cricket terms - he was brash, arrogant and 'hated' the Poms - what was there to like but that doesn't stop you appreciating his brilliance as a bowler.
As I got older I realised alot of his comments etc were tongue in cheek and I grew to really like him
He was very quick when he was younger.
As he got a little older, he was still plenty quick enough but had great control of the ball and regularly found the seam.
His action was a thing of beauty, as pleasing to the eye as any bowler I've ever seen.
And I'm saying this as an Englishman who hated him in cricket terms - he was brash, arrogant and 'hated' the Poms - what was there to like but that doesn't stop you appreciating his brilliance as a bowler.
As I got older I realised alot of his comments etc were tongue in cheek and I grew to really like him
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Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
I "proved" it earlier in the thread. Look back.
In all seriousness Lillee was an ATG, while Southee isn't one (high quality international bowler nonetheless).
Burgey
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If Lillee did nothing else’s in his career, the last over of day one he bowled to Richard’s at the MCG on Boxing Day in 81 would make him an ATG. Everyone has seen the last ball where he bowls him, but the whole thing was just genius. just watch the whole thing if you get a chance.
Couple of bouncers which Viv played poorly (for him anyway), couple of outswingers perfectly pitched and then that last ball where he just pulled an inswinger out of his arse which he didn’t pick and started wide enough of off to draw him into a drive before catching trhe inside edge. It was a six ball bowling clinic.
Couple of bouncers which Viv played poorly (for him anyway), couple of outswingers perfectly pitched and then that last ball where he just pulled an inswinger out of his arse which he didn’t pick and started wide enough of off to draw him into a drive before catching trhe inside edge. It was a six ball bowling clinic.
Adders
Cricketer Of The Year
You could lodge a very good argument for Dennis being in the top 10 granted, but it's by no means a done deal. Very easy to name 10 names his equal or better imo.
But the point remains he is a level below McGrath......ill die on that hill.
Line and Length
Cricketer Of The Year
Here's how CW members rated the fast bowlers a year or two back.
| 1. Malcolm Marshall |
| 2. Glenn McGrath |
| 3. Richard Hadlee |
| 4. Curtly Ambrose |
| 5. Dale Steyn |
| 6. Imran Khan |
| 7. Dennis Lillee |
| 8. Fred Trueman |
| 9. Wasim Akram |
| 10. Allan Donald I might add Southee came in at #40 and Hoggard didn't rate a mention. |