***Official New Zealand in India Nov-Dec 2021 Thread***

[nzfan]

I can't believe you guys think Taylor shouldn't be playing .... honestly, even in his worst form he's one batter I rate as high as Kane to get us through. They can't do it all the time but they do consistently enough.

 

[trundler]

even in his worst form he's one batter I rate as high as Kane to get us through

That's just praising with faint damnation in an away series

 

[nzfan]

Still haven't caught up on last night's game since Kane's dismissal. I was so disappointed I gave up. Need to watch ball by ball to understand why Rachin is all over the media today when we had Latham, Young, Sommerville, Kyle and Southee absolutely outperform. I expect Rachin to bat out as many balls as he did. It's definitely not a surprise given his ability. He does it all the time for Firebirds. He nearly did it last month vs Canterbury batting like near 300 balls. Think of his debut vs Pak A, the series was on the line. I think we were supposed to get like 200 in two sessions or something Rachin was demoted to no.8 and all the big names like Watling, Raval etc were gone (can't remember all of it but vaguely remember) and Rachin came in at no 8 or 7 or 6 and batted out the rest of the day with Kyle I think. Or think of his much awaited debut for Wellington, on a green track after ND or CD one of them were bowled out for like 100 he came out and scored near 100 while the super experienced Woody gave him a rather quiet company.

He's a proper batsman and expectation is he does bat out at least 90 balls. I guess unless I watch the game ball by ball and understand the ploy from India, the quality of bowling etc I wouldn't get the feel yet. Ajaz played out last 6 balls, I thought Rachin would have tried to farm strike. Not being critical at all I'm a huge fan of Rachin but just trying to understand how the media is all over him.

 

[Bahnz]

I can't believe you guys think Taylor shouldn't be playing .... honestly, even in his worst form he's one batter I rate as high as Kane to get us through. They can't do it all the time but they do consistently enough.

Taylor averages sub-20 in Asia since 2014. In India he averages 12 since Jadeja debuted. His technique with that crouched open stance and propensity to drive and cut was never well suited to the sub-continent, but as his powers have waned he's become a bit of liability imo.

He will play of course. He shouldn't even try to defend imo. Should just cut and slash away and hope his luck holds long enough to get an arsey 50.

 

[vandem]

.... I expect Rachin to bat out as many balls as he did. It's definitely not a surprise given his ability. He does it all the time for Firebirds. He nearly did it last month vs Canterbury batting like near 300 balls. Think of his debut vs Pak A, the series was on the line. I think we were supposed to get like 200 in two sessions or something Rachin was demoted to no.8 and all the big names like Watling, Raval etc were gone (can't remember all of it but vaguely remember) and Rachin came in at no 8 or 7 or 6 and batted out the rest of the day with Kyle I think. Or think of his much awaited debut for Wellington, on a green track after ND or CD one of them were bowled out for like 100 he came out and scored near 100 while the super experienced Woody gave him a rather quiet company....

Scoreboards linked below. Ravindra's 2nd FC game Pak A vs NZ in UAE. 6th FC game (and 1st for Wellington) vs CD.

I think NZ Cricket have handled his early career well. Early games for NZ A (and I understand regular winter training camps with Black Caps) but then resisted the urge to pick him as the bench player in summer white ball squads, instead let him play for Wellington where he got to open alongside experienced Woodcock and bowl alongside experienced Jeetan Patel.

https://archive.nzc.nz/Scorecards/1088/1088319.html

https://archive.nzc.nz/Scorecards/1087/1087432.html

 

[Bahnz]

He's a proper batsman and expectation is he does bat out at least 90 balls. I guess unless I watch the game ball by ball and understand the ploy from India, the quality of bowling etc I wouldn't get the feel yet. Ajaz played out last 6 balls, I thought Rachin would have tried to farm strike. Not being critical at all I'm a huge fan of Rachin but just trying to understand how the media is all over him.

Batting in the last half hour in particular was very difficult, with the 2nd new ball rolling through almost as often as it bounced normally and the light and atmospheric conditions beginning to resemble Mordor. And besides all that, the pressure of having to save the game for your team on debut was immense. Champion effort.

 

[thierry henry]

I’m the biggest Ross Taylor fan you’ll find but 37 year old Ross in the subcontinent is basically odds on to fail

 

[nzfan]

Scoreboards linked below. Ravindra's 2nd FC game Pak A vs NZ in UAE. 6th FC game (and 1st for Wellington) vs CD.

I think NZ Cricket have handled his early career well. Early games for NZ A (and I understand regular winter training camps with Black Caps) but then resisted the urge to pick him as the bench player in summer white ball squads, instead let him play for Wellington where he got to open alongside experienced Woodcock and bowl alongside experienced Jeetan Patel.

https://archive.nzc.nz/Scorecards/1088/1088319.html

https://archive.nzc.nz/Scorecards/1087/1087432.html

Terrific find... the NZ A had Raval, Young, Seifert, Phillips, Blundell, Bruce as batters. Obviously Rachin was well guided there. It hasn't come over night. Good number of Pakistan players international players as well. I like the NZ A programme, Kyle, Darryl Mitchell all came through the path way.

 

[Burgey]

Test cricket, eh. What a beauty. Big effort NZ to hang on. Just quality stuff.

 

[SteveNZ]

I can't believe you guys think Taylor shouldn't be playing .... honestly, even in his worst form he's one batter I rate as high as Kane to get us through. They can't do it all the time but they do consistently enough.

I think the thing is, you can make cases that others are better run-scoring options than him at every position from 3 down. And all of those options are 5-6 years younger than him. Granted, none of them probably would've scored the composed 47 not he did in the WTC final, but we're not playing a big Test like that for the rest of his career.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

I have to confess I didn't watch a ball of this test live. I also tried to avoid checking the score or match threads. I've been trying to control my stress levels of late, and Test matches from India with the cauldron of noise (if that's still the case during COVID) do tend to raise stress levels. Given how the Test progressed, I think my stress scores would have been through the roof. As it was, I went to bed last night safe in the knowledge that NZ would have lost. And had the joy of finding out this morning via Radio NZ that they hadn't.

 

[GotSpin]

Decent draw that
Thought the Indian players would need just get on the team bus to ensure a win

 

[straw man]

Just gonna say it, Taylor shouldn’t play the second test. Apart from an 80 scored on day 1 against a weak SL attack, he hasn’t made runs in Asia since 2014. Further, his weakness against left arm spin will always be pretty brutally exposed by Jadeja and Axar. Don’t expect a whole lot from Phillips in his place but I reckon he has a higher ceiling unless the mumbai surface is a road.

I think we were in agreement on this prior to the WTC final, given how bad he looked against England, though he surprised us all by contributing a few runs in the final. Brilliant career and love him to bits obviously, however India is the single worst place in the world for a declining Taylor to tour and it would've been a travesty if Young had been left out (Conway not injured) to accommodate Taylor this test.

Taylor in India
2010
Ahmedabad: 56, Hyderabad: 24 & 7, Nagpur: 20 & 29
2012
Hyderabad: 2 & 7, Bengaluru: 113 & 35
2016
Kanpur: 0 & 17, Kolkata: 36 & 4, Indore: 0 & 32
2021
Kanpur: 11 & 2

In short he played one magnificent attacking innings in 2012 in Bengaluru where he hit, swept out of the rough repeatedly, cut late, took risks and it paid off. And every other innings India have had his number, especially in 2016. 102 runs at 12.75 over 8 innings from 2016 to now.

He will play of course. He shouldn't even try to defend imo. Should just cut and slash away and hope his luck holds long enough to get an arsey 50.

Yup.

 

[straw man]

Wagner for Nicholls. Somers outbatted Henry in both innings.

Nicholls vs India watch: 8 innings, 71 runs @ 10.14. They really have his number home and away.

That said re Taylor, I didn't realise how bad Nicholls had been against India even at home.

**** it, drop one of those two and play Wagner, only one test to go and it's a chance to steal a rare series win in India.

 

[SteveNZ]

Batting in the last half hour in particular was very difficult, with the 2nd new ball rolling through almost as often as it bounced normally and the light and atmospheric conditions beginning to resemble Mordor. And besides all that, the pressure of having to save the game for your team on debut was immense. Champion effort.

Yeah, it reiterates the proud post I made a few weeks ago about how I know I can switch on my TV at any hour of the day, when NZ is playing in any corner of the world, and know they'll compete and make it worthwhile for me to be up at some ungodly hour. Same again last night.

 

[Days of Grace]

I have to confess I didn't watch a ball of this test live. I also tried to avoid checking the score or match threads. I've been trying to control my stress levels of late, and Test matches from India with the cauldron of noise (if that's still the case during COVID) do tend to raise stress levels. Given how the Test progressed, I think my stress scores would have been through the roof. As it was, I went to bed last night safe in the knowledge that NZ would have lost. And had the joy of finding out this morning via Radio NZ that they hadn't.

Now that radio sport has ended, is there still sport talkback in New Zealand? Or a radio station dedicated to sport?

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Now that radio sport has ended, is there still sport talkback in New Zealand? Or a radio station dedicated to sport?

SENZ which started about when the Olympics did.

Can be found online through googling pretty easily.

Has Brendan McCullum and Israel Dagg on in the mornings followed by Ian Smith.

They had Grant Elliot commentating the World T20 from in front of a tv in NZ.

I've listened occasionally

 

[honestbharani]

Yeah, it reiterates the proud post I made a few weeks ago about how I know I can switch on my TV at any hour of the day, when NZ is playing in any corner of the world, and know they'll compete and make it worthwhile for me to be up at some ungodly hour. Same again last night.

Yeah, I feel the same way about India. I think the only place we have not competed now has been in NZ and even though it has been a couple of 2-0s recently, I think it will change next time we tour. I think its lucky that we have two such good sides and it absolutely sucks that NZ seem to have the wood over us for some reason. Hopefully it changes with Rahul in charge.

 

[Bahnz]

What happens to the rankings if India end up winning the series 1-0?

Yeah, I feel the same way about India. I think the only place we have not competed now has been in NZ and even though it has been a couple of 2-0s recently, I think it will change next time we tour. I think its lucky that we have two such good sides and it absolutely sucks that NZ seem to have the wood over us for some reason. Hopefully it changes with Rahul in charge.

Would love a 5 test series between NZ and India in NZ. Will obviously never happen but we'd see some incredible back and forth cricket. 2 test series makes life a bit too tough for India, no time to adjust to the conditions, and they're never given the chance to play at the more spin friendly surfaces like Mt Maunganui and Seddon Park.

 

[honestbharani]

What happens to the rankings if India end up winning the series 1-0?


Would love a 5 test series between NZ and India in NZ. Will obviously never happen but we'd see some incredible back and forth cricket. 2 test series makes life a bit too tough for India, no time to adjust to the conditions, and they're never given the chance to play at the more spin friendly surfaces like Mt Maunganui and Seddon Park.

I think at least 3 test series should be there between Ind-NZ both home and away. We did have it in the past iterations.