Establishing the best decade for cricket: Finding the ATG XI from 12 decades of test cricket - then having a KO tourney to decide the best

[The Sean]

No I was confused, thanks for clearing that up for me.

Happy to help.

 

[271 & 16/166]

Boucher
Kumble

Both unloved and not forgotten

 

[h_hurricane]

Gilchrist
Pollock

 

[Gob]

Pollock sort of lost it after 03/04 and went downhill fast after that and be is far too similar to McGrath. Both Shoaib and Bond would add much more variety. Some overall CW decision making has been a real disappointment throughout this exercise. People have been far too reliant on spreadsheets

 

[h_hurricane]

Pollock sort of lost it after 03/04 and went downhill fast after that and be is far too similar to McGrath. Both Shoaib and Bond would add much more variety. Some overall CW decision making has been a real disappointment throughout this exercise. People have been far too reliant on spreadsheets

No, most people here have seen Pollock and he was a truly great cricketer. He should make one of the 2 teams, either 90s or 2000s. His inclusion only strengthens 2000s team when the number of ATG bowlers were very less, and he was one. Additionally, his batting is such a great bonus.

 

[The Sean]

Realised I’ve been commenting a lot but not voted.

Gilchrist
Warne

And for the avoidance of doubt, I think Pollock was a fantastic cricketer. I just can’t pick him here – and I realise that puts me very much in the minority on this one.

I get people don’t want two spinners – though I am somewhat less sympathetic to that thinking when the two in question are the two greatest spinners ever, and more than that are two of the absolute greatest ever bowlers full stop.

I get that a lot of people want to pick another specialist bat at 6 and don’t want to have play Kallis as the third seamer – and I agree, that’s not my ideal situation either.

And I get that people like the idea of keeping the ‘90s and ‘00s teams separate with two completely different XIs – and yes, I like that idea too and love that we have such a talent pool to be able to do it.

But for me it’s also about picking the best possible team to win matches in the biggest moments against the greatest players of all time, which in this exercise is who these teams are playing against. With that in mind – and this is just one guy’s opinion, of course – across all conditions and opposition there is simply no reality in which this team wins more games by picking Shaun Pollock than it does by picking Shane Warne. None.

 

[Gob]

No, most people here have seen Pollock and he was a truly great cricketer. He should make one of the 2 teams, either 90s or 2000s. His inclusion only strengthens 2000s team when the number of ATG bowlers were very less, and he was one. Additionally, his batting is such a great bonus.

Shaun Pollock averaged 25 post 2000 and 27 post 2002. Those are by no means ATG numbers and you know what I was not aware of those numbers before checking in but kind of accepted that. Also like how you assumed I hadn't seen Pollock bowl no **** I did. I remember him bowling offspin in Sri Lanka around 2006 and pretty toothless in Australia before that.
But more than that you already have McGrath who did everything Pollock did but better and Steyn who bowls out swing so why not pick someone who brings something different to the table like Shoaib?

 

[h_hurricane]

Shaun Pollock averaged 25 post 2000 and 27 post 2002. Those are by no means ATG numbers and you know what I was not aware of those numbers before checking in but kind of accepted that. Also like how you assumed I hadn't seen Pollock bowl no **** I did. I remember him bowling offspin in Sri Lanka around 2006 and pretty toothless in Australia before that.
But more than that you already have McGrath who did everything Pollock did but better and Steyn who bowls out swing so why not pick someone who brings something different to the table like Shoaib?

Mcgrath and Steyn were better than him in 2000s but the proposition is that Pollock was better than everyone else which is probably true. I can understand Akhtar and Bond can be more explosive, but who would rely on them to last a 5 test series. Their careers are pretty comprehensive indicators that you could not depend on them bowl like 1000 deliveries in a series and pick 20-25 wickets. In an ATG team, never ever pick anyone with dodgy fitness.
On a different note, Warne is not competing with Pollock. Every ATG team needs a 3rd great pacer. Warne is a good pick along with Murali if batting depth is not a concern.

 

[Gob]

Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo.com

stats.espncricinfo.com

Good case to include both Warne and Shoaib and not Pollock

 

[srbhkshk]

Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo.com

stats.espncricinfo.com

Good case to include both Warne and Shoaib and not Pollock

We already have Steyn, McGrath and Murali for the SR, if anything that's far more of a reasoning to pick Pollock.

In any case, while picking him personally I have factored in his batting as well, even though he is close to the other options purely on bowling as well.

 

[honestbharani]

I personally wont pick Kallis and Flintoff but if we are, I can see why we can play both Warne and Murali.

But even if it is only one spinner, I would rather have Murali and Shoaib, Steyn and McGrath. You get 3 very different seamers this way and then you can add in Kallis' or Flintoff's bowling as well which again, will be different to these 3.

 

[h_hurricane]

Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo.com

stats.espncricinfo.com

Good case to include both Warne and Shoaib and not Pollock

Again, only solidifies my earlier point. Pakistan played 83 tests in 2000s and Shoaib only played 33 of them, which is barely 40%. He was an active cricketer until WC 2011 when he was 35.

He played his last test in 2007. He was banned from playing international cricket by the board around 2008 but then came back to play ODIs in 2009. He wasn't fit enough to last any full test series during his last 2-3 years and probably wasn't picked for the same reason.

 

[a massive zebra]

Gilchrist
Pollock

 

[Bolo.]

Shaun Pollock averaged 25 post 2000 and 27 post 2002. Those are by no means ATG numbers and you know what I was not aware of those numbers before checking in but kind of accepted that. Also like how you assumed I hadn't seen Pollock bowl no **** I did. I remember him bowling offspin in Sri Lanka around 2006 and pretty toothless in Australia before that.
But more than that you already have McGrath who did everything Pollock did but better and Steyn who bowls out swing so why not pick someone who brings something different to the table like Shoaib?

Pollock went sub 25 for the decade, which is normally accepted at ATG levels, and should definitely be for the 2000s.

The last part of your statement definitely makes sense, and I am not sure Pollock deserves a spot purely as a bowler based on variety. But you also need to take into account the fact that his 2 dips in form were from injuries bad injuries that he kept playing through, despite big losses in pace. If he had been sitting out every couple of games like Shoaib, he would have been sitting on much better stats, and his batting is hard to ignore.

 

[ankitj]

With exception of in Australia, Pollock has such a well rounded record everywhere else. Even in subcontinent he has a record that top tier fast bowlers will be proud to have.

 

[Michaelf7777777]

Gilchrist
Warne

 

[stephen]

Gilchrist
Shoaib

I feel like two spinners is unnecessary. Shoaib gives that raw pace option. McGrath/ Steyn/ Shoaib/ Murali/ Kallis is about the best bowling attack you'll ever see.

 

[Slifer]

Gilchrist
Shoaib

I feel like two spinners is unnecessary. Shoaib gives that raw pace option. McGrath/ Steyn/ Shoaib/ Murali/ Kallis is about the best bowling attack you'll ever see.

I'd actually give it to the 90s attack tbh

 

[sunilz]

@mr_mister
Are you alive? If you are dead then RIP ?

 

[The Sean]

@mr_mister
Are you alive? If you are dead then RIP ?

He's ringing around trying to get a bunch of new people to sign up and vote for Warne. I'm helping him.