*Unofficial* New Zealand Black Caps Thread

[Nintendo]

Not sure why Allen can't play red ball cricket and succeed. If Pant can or Hetmeyer can so can Allen. The sample size so far of Allen is quite small to decide he's not going to be good enough in red ball cricket. If he wants it then he sure can be a pretty good player of red ball cricket. It just takes time to develop in red ball cricket and have to ride the highs and lows. Allen isn't as wild as Pant and with proper training can adopt. He doesn't have to bat at the top of the order. Maybe bat him at 6. He's been a wicket keeper as well and if he can grow into a wicket keeping batsman role he could be like Butler for us. I think BCs should play Ravindra at no.4 and let him bowl. It's too much to ask a player to open batting and bowl loads (in sub continent)

I wouldn't call hetmyr someoene who "plays red ball cricket and succeeds" Kinda like calling mitch marsh "Australia's best test all-rounder since miller."

 

[Immenso]

Not sure why Allen can't play red ball cricket and succeed. If Pant can or Hetmeyer can so can Allen. The sample size so far of Allen is quite small to decide he's not going to be good enough in red ball cricket. If he wants it then he sure can be a pretty good player of red ball cricket. It just takes time to develop in red ball cricket and have to ride the highs and lows. Allen isn't as wild as Pant and with proper training can adopt. He doesn't have to bat at the top of the order. Maybe bat him at 6. He's been a wicket keeper as well and if he can grow into a wicket keeping batsman role he could be like Butler for us. I think BCs should play Ravindra at no.4 and let him bowl. It's too much to ask a player to open batting and bowl loads (in sub continent)

Allen's red-ball development (and he still needs a lot of it on evidence so far) will be stunted to virtually zero by the simple fact that he won't play virtually any of if as he will be in the national white ball team and miss 80 to 100% of the Plunket Shield season each year. E.g. the Santner effect.

That's my take. Not necessarily down to desire or talent. But NZC's woeful scheduling will likely scupper him as a red ball player. I have little hope.

Got lop-sidedly too successful, too young.

 

[SteveNZ]

Allen's red-ball development (and he still needs a lot of it on evidence so far) will be stunted to virtually zero by the simple fact that he won't play virtually any of if as he will be in the national white ball team and miss 80 to 100% of the Plunket Shield season each year. E.g. the Santner effect.

That's my take. Not necessarily down to desire or talent. But NZC's woeful scheduling will likely scupper him as a red ball player. I have little hope.

Got lop-sidedly too successful, too young.

Yeah. I wouldn't factor in Finn Allen becoming any sort of red ball player. Lack of exposure and probably if we're being honest, lack of desire. I don't blame NZC so much. He's going to play in franchise teams, for our T20/ODI sides probably, and be happy with that. Can't blame the guy

 

[nzfan]

Allen's red-ball development (and he still needs a lot of it on evidence so far) will be stunted to virtually zero by the simple fact that he won't play virtually any of if as he will be in the national white ball team and miss 80 to 100% of the Plunket Shield season each year. E.g. the Santner effect.

That's my take. Not necessarily down to desire or talent. But NZC's woeful scheduling will likely scupper him as a red ball player. I have little hope.

Got lop-sidedly too successful, too young.

True with him now in very high demand in all the leagues around the world and if he does go for it then likely he will start to miss most of the first class unless he can grab a first class contract over in UK. With only 8 games in a season and likely for one or two to rain off he's better off looking for a gig in UK where he can play plenty of first class games. Otherwise like you said he may not feature in firebirds first class side at all.

There is a qualification to be drafted into first class side though. He needs to have played like 8 white ball games or a test match within the last two years (not entirely sure of the qualification conditions but that's definitely there). That said he also has UK passport so technically shouldn't have a problem playing county cricket.

 

[TheBrand]

So....when's this supposed tour of India?

When are we next playing tests? This is killing me...

all these pointless t20s and useless ODIs. There's a tour of Aus in Jan which is 3 random ODIs...who GAF? play a test FFS

Two test in December.

Hardly pointless T20's with a WC around the corner?

 

[hendrix]

T20 world cup is pointless too

 

[The Hutt Rec]

It is a bit pointless when there’s another one in 12 months time, tbh

 

[_Ed_]

Yeah, that's insane. It's been five years since the last one, so I'm really looking forward to it (especially with a team like PNG there for the first time), but two in such quick succession is nonsensical scheduling.

 

[SteveNZ]

Yeah, that's insane. It's been five years since the last one, so I'm really looking forward to it (especially with a team like PNG there for the first time), but two in such quick succession is nonsensical scheduling.

I know this wasn't COVID related, why did it happen in the first place?

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

 

[nzfan]

Two test in December.

Hardly pointless T20's with a WC around the corner?

It's a bit pointless when you are not going to pick a single players from the Bangladesh/Pakistan t20 series for the WC (Handful of players that'll play t20 WC play vs Pakistan t20s I think).

 

[Flem274*]

It's a bit pointless when you are not going to pick a single players from the Bangladesh/Pakistan t20 series for the WC (Handful of players that'll play t20 WC play vs Pakistan t20s I think).

I think NZC are looking ahead to the 2023 ODI WC and perhaps even giving some of the players a look for the Indian series.

Speaking of, I suspect Cole McConchie is a solid chance of being on that flight (much to the horror of several posters on here I bet). They've been developing him for some time, and they are probably really keen on a spin bowling allrounder so we can jam another quick into the side. Somerville is 37 now, and I'm not sure how much Shield he will get before they leave. It's quite probable Quick/Quick/Quick/Ajaz/McConchie feels stronger to the selectors than Quick/Quick/CDG/Ajaz/Somerville.

We already know Wagner is 4th picked quick in the eyes of the selectors thanks to the WTC gossip, so I'm going to nostradamus the squad and the side for Test #1.

Latham
Conway
WIlliamson (c)
Taylor
Nicholls
Blundell (wk)
McConchie
Jamieson
Southee
Ajaz
Boult

CDG
Wagner
Somerville
Young

Of course, it's more likely you can swap Santner's name for McConchie's and they might frustrate every fan and pick Southee/Boult/CDG/Ajaz/Santner.

 

[Kippax]

I think with all the Hutt Hawks tours in his teens, Larsen will definitely put Ravindra in the Test squad for India.

Not that he racked up the runs against the Pondicherry academy spinners etc. on those tours. Pretty difficult pitches, very alien to the indoor carpet he grooved his batting style on.

 

[Nintendo]

I think NZC are looking ahead to the 2023 ODI WC and perhaps even giving some of the players a look for the Indian series.

Speaking of, I suspect Cole McConchie is a solid chance of being on that flight (much to the horror of several posters on here I bet). They've been developing him for some time, and they are probably really keen on a spin bowling allrounder so we can jam another quick into the side. Somerville is 37 now, and I'm not sure how much Shield he will get before they leave. It's quite probable Quick/Quick/Quick/Ajaz/McConchie feels stronger to the selectors than Quick/Quick/CDG/Ajaz/Somerville.

We already know Wagner is 4th picked quick in the eyes of the selectors thanks to the WTC gossip, so I'm going to nostradamus the squad and the side for Test #1.

Latham
Conway
WIlliamson (c)
Taylor
Nicholls
Blundell (wk)
McConchie
Jamieson
Southee
Ajaz
Boult

CDG
Wagner
Somerville
Young

Of course, it's more likely you can swap Santner's name for McConchie's and they might frustrate every fan and pick Southee/Boult/CDG/Ajaz/Santner.

Wagner as 4th picked seamer in indian conditions would be insane. Left arm angle+wagnerball+reverse swing makes him the best pacer they have for indian pitches.

 

[nzfan]

I think NZC are looking ahead to the 2023 ODI WC and perhaps even giving some of the players a look for the Indian series.

Speaking of, I suspect Cole McConchie is a solid chance of being on that flight (much to the horror of several posters on here I bet). They've been developing him for some time, and they are probably really keen on a spin bowling allrounder so we can jam another quick into the side. Somerville is 37 now, and I'm not sure how much Shield he will get before they leave. It's quite probable Quick/Quick/Quick/Ajaz/McConchie feels stronger to the selectors than Quick/Quick/CDG/Ajaz/Somerville.

We already know Wagner is 4th picked quick in the eyes of the selectors thanks to the WTC gossip, so I'm going to nostradamus the squad and the side for Test #1.

Latham
Conway
WIlliamson (c)
Taylor
Nicholls
Blundell (wk)
McConchie
Jamieson
Southee
Ajaz
Boult

CDG
Wagner
Somerville
Young

Of course, it's more likely you can swap Santner's name for McConchie's and they might frustrate every fan and pick Southee/Boult/CDG/Ajaz/Santner.

No way... too far away the wc to even think about it. Simply put Ajaz and Cole have a spot just because Santner and Ish aren't available. Ajaz will likely not even make the side unless he has phenomenal lead up. I think there's more chances of Allen and Ravindra making the side.

 

[nzfan]

As for the Indian series Ajaz, Ravindra and Somerville are must. Phillips has a better shot than Cole.

 

[Flem274*]

Hey @Immenso cheers bro for your kiwi seamers channel. It's fun watching. If you have any longer footage of these guys then that would be cool to see next.

 

[SteveNZ]

As for the Indian series Ajaz, Ravindra and Somerville are must. Phillips has a better shot than Cole.

I can't see Somerville being a part of any NZ sides going forward. No real basis for saying that, I just think they have moved on.

 

[Bahnz]

I know this wasn't COVID related, why did it happen in the first place?

I thought it was Covid related? Wasn’t the WT20 originally meant to be held in October/November 2020 but got canned due to covid and the consequent delaying of the IPL from April/May to the end of the year?

 

[Bahnz]

I can't see Somerville being a part of any NZ sides going forward. No real basis for saying that, I just think they have moved on.

I’d be very surprised if he doesn’t tour India given his success in the UAE and SL. I do think that’ll probably be his last series but I think NZ will shy away from playing uncapped spinners there and will have (hopefully) finally learnt their lessons about Santner’s limitations in tests.