Euro 2020 General Discussion

[Uppercut]

I’m finding it hard to believe that the Spanish keeper letting that backpass under his foot happened today and not a couple of weeks ago. Always the sign of a great day of football.

 

[wpdavid]

Has there been a better day of tournament football?

I don't think so, but 16 June 1984 deserves an honourable mention. France and Denmark both beat their opponents 5-0, so the matches weren't exactly close. And they were group matches rather than knock-out. But the quality of football was outstanding; peak Denmark made for wonderful viewing, as did peak France, with Platini scoring one of his two hat-tricks in the tournament.

 

[wpdavid]

And 17 June 1970 wasn't bad either, especially for a pair of WC semi-finals. Brazil came from behind to beat Uruguay 3-1, playing some unbelievable football of course. It was the game when Pele famously dummied the Uruguay keeper but sent the ball wide. But the other semi-final was even better, with Italy and Germany sharing five goals in extra time after finishing the 90 minutes at 1-1.

Hand on heart, I wouldn't argue that it was better than what we saw yesterday, but maybe worth a mention as part of the discussion.

 

[Howe_zat]

If England play Czechia in the semi final, it'll be the 4th time they've played each other in the same competition. Has that ever happened in a Euro/world cup before?

 

[speirz]

If England play Czechia in the semi final, it'll be the 4th time they've played each other in the same competition. Has that ever happened in a Euro/world cup before?

Not sure when they've met otherwise, but Argentina-Germany has been the World Cup final three times.

Edit: Completely misunderstood. That would surely be a record.

 

[GIMH]

If England play Czechia in the semi final, it'll be the 4th time they've played each other in the same competition. Has that ever happened in a Euro/world cup before?

Now you're asking.

Meeting the same team twice in the finals obviously rare but can happen - saw it with England/Belgium in the last WC. Brazil/Sweden in 94. Portugal/Greece in Euro 04.

Similarly, playing a side you played in qualifying can happen, as clearly it has here.

The odds of both happening though, are surely very low.

Interesting stat. Probably wouldn't take too long to go through and find the tournaments where teams have played twice and go from there. Already we can safely rule out Portgual/Greece as Portgual were hosts, and obviously Brazil didn't play Sweden in qualifying. England/Belgium didn't either.

 

[Howe_zat]

Now you're asking.

Meeting the same team twice in the finals obviously rare but can happen - saw it with England/Belgium in the last WC. Brazil/Sweden in 94. Portugal/Greece in Euro 04.

Similarly, playing a side you played in qualifying can happen, as clearly it has here.

The odds of both happening though, are surely very low.

Interesting stat. Probably wouldn't take too long to go through and find the tournaments where teams have played twice and go from there. Already we can safely rule out Portgual/Greece as Portgual were hosts, and obviously Brazil didn't play Sweden in qualifying. England/Belgium didn't either.

How old is modern style home and away qualifying?

I know the early world cups were mostly about which teams could be bothered to go on the boat trip

 

[GIMH]

It goes back very early but for the Euros you'd only get one team per group going through prior to 96. For the WC, Europe has had the top two able to qualify for a while now. Not sure on specifics without looking it up

 

[wpdavid]

How old is modern style home and away qualifying?

I know the early world cups were mostly about which teams could be bothered to go on the boat trip

World Cups had home and away qualifying groups since 1958 for the home nations. 1950 & 1954 were based on the home internationals.
Pre-WW2 seems to be based on fairly random invitations. As you say, we didn't fancy the trip to Uruguay in 1930, and just didn't fancy taking part in the Europe-based WCs of the 1930s.

In answer to your question, the modern style where the top two teams go through started for the 1982 WC, which was a good job as we had made an absolute pig's ear of qualifying. Ultimately we needed Switzerland to secure the flukiest win imaginable in Romania to give us the opportunity to sneak home in second place behind Hungary. The home and away qualifying groups in the 1970s only saw the top side qualify, which was beyond us, although the Scots made a better fist of things.

As for the Euros, I think the top 2 from the group qualifying probably started with the 1996 tournament. Previous Euros had only included eight teams, so it must have been just the group winner before 1996. Our first home and away qualifying group was for 1972, when we managed to finish ahead of Greece, Switzerland and Malta. In 1968, we finished top of the home internationals based a a combined table for 1966 and 1967.

EDIT
I just saw that GIMH made the same point about the 1996 Euros. Sorry mate, I really should start reading your contributions.

 

[wpdavid]

Now you're asking.

Meeting the same team twice in the finals obviously rare but can happen - saw it with England/Belgium in the last WC. Brazil/Sweden in 94. Portugal/Greece in Euro 04.

Similarly, playing a side you played in qualifying can happen, as clearly it has here.

The odds of both happening though, are surely very low.

Interesting stat. Probably wouldn't take too long to go through and find the tournaments where teams have played twice and go from there. Already we can safely rule out Portgual/Greece as Portgual were hosts, and obviously Brazil didn't play Sweden in qualifying. England/Belgium didn't either.

Italy met Poland twice in the 1982 WC. In the first group stage and then in the semi-final. No idea about their qualifying groups yet.

EDIT
Nope, scratch that for Italy and Poland. However, West Germany and Austria met home & away in their qualifying group for 1982 and also in the first group stage in Spain. So there's a three for you.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

I think at the World Cup it was always quite hard cos they tried to avoid putting teams from the same group against each other too early (which you can do when there's two teams in each group that qualify)

 

[BoyBrumby]

Hungary and West Germany met twice in 1954, Jerry avenging an 8-3 group stage loss 3-2 in the final, and Brazil and Czechoslovakia also played each other twice in 1962, Brazil winning the final (sans the injured Pele) 3-1 after a 1-1 draw in the group stages.

 

[wpdavid]

Hungary and West Germany met twice in 1954, Jerry avenging an 8-3 group stage loss 3-2 in the final, and Brazil and Czechoslovakia also played each other twice in 1962, Brazil winning the final (sans the injured Pele) 3-1 after a 1-1 draw in the group stages.

Sticking with your theme, Holland and the Soviet Union met in the group stage of the 1988 Euros and again in the Final.

 

[GIMH]

Sticking with your theme, Holland and the Soviet Union met in the group stage of the 1988 Euros and again in the Final.

Germany/Czech in 96 too

 

[Howe_zat]

Austria-Germany at 1982 seems the closest so far since both sides infamously got through the group, and could have met again in the semis if Austria had made it.

I think it looks like it'll be a first if England meet the Czechs again.

 

[wpdavid]

Austria-Germany at 1982 seems the closest so far since both sides infamously got through the group, and could have met again in the semis if Austria had made it.

I think it looks like it'll be a first if England meet the Czechs again.

You're probably right. I can only offer another three involving Netherlands and West Germany with the 1990 WC. They played each other in the qualifying group, which maybe created the bad feeling when they found themselves within spitting distance in the knock-out stages.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

You're probably right. I can only offer another three involving Netherlands and West Germany with the 1990 WC. They played each other in the qualifying group, which maybe created the bad feeling when they found themselves within spitting distance in the knock-out stages.

Euro 88 semifinal too (although I'm not sure how getting beaten by *that* van Basten goal bred bad blood)

Might have been some of their grandads' racism from the Germans against Rijkaard and Gullit too

 

[Pothas]

I think at the World Cup it was always quite hard cos they tried to avoid putting teams from the same group against each other too early (which you can do when there's two teams in each group that qualify)

Yeah I was thinking South America because they all play each other twice in qualifying but we have not had an all South American final in forever. In fact not had one since the first ever World Cup have we?

Oh actually 1950 but that was not technically a final was it.

 

[GIMH]

I don't think South Americans can play each other twice at the WC as they all get seeded apart.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Euro 88 semifinal too (although I'm not sure how getting beaten by *that* van Basten goal bred bad blood)

Thought his wonder volley was against the Soviets in the final?