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The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread
- Thread starter Red
- Start date
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Or Miandad
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Javed Miandad was better than all the no 5s
GoodAreasShane
Cricketer Of The Year
Yeah, because McCullum using his book to take cheap shots at Ross Taylor is the epitome of courage and bravery...
bagapath
International Captain
He was a no.4 specialist
stephen
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Personally I think Tendulkar's longevity is a little overplayed. What's remarkable is that he was good enough to be a test batsman in the first 5 years of his career, rather than hope long he played at the other end.
The fact that he was Indian helped on both accounts. When he started India had crap batsmen which saw him debut earlier than he would have for a better nation. There were massive wraps on Ponting as a teenager too but he wasn't able to crack the test side until he was 21. At the other end, slower Indian pitches meant that declining ability versus pace was a lot less impactful on his career than it is for South African batsmen.
Personality I rate Smith so highly not because of his average but because of the conditions of those runs. He has batted on a different planet over the last 7 years. His last home series against South Africa isn't really talked about but he was immense in that series regardless of the quality of the attack or pitch conditions (Rabada/ Philander/Abbott in good bowling conditions).
Tendulkar was incredible and deserves all the plaudits he's gotten. I just happen to think that Smith has made tougher runs in more challenging conditions.
The fact that he was Indian helped on both accounts. When he started India had crap batsmen which saw him debut earlier than he would have for a better nation. There were massive wraps on Ponting as a teenager too but he wasn't able to crack the test side until he was 21. At the other end, slower Indian pitches meant that declining ability versus pace was a lot less impactful on his career than it is for South African batsmen.
Personality I rate Smith so highly not because of his average but because of the conditions of those runs. He has batted on a different planet over the last 7 years. His last home series against South Africa isn't really talked about but he was immense in that series regardless of the quality of the attack or pitch conditions (Rabada/ Philander/Abbott in good bowling conditions).
Tendulkar was incredible and deserves all the plaudits he's gotten. I just happen to think that Smith has made tougher runs in more challenging conditions.
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
True, but why not bat him one lower?
the big bambino
Cricketer Of The Year
Its the only wat I'll have vegetables.
the big bambino
Cricketer Of The Year
Depends what arguments you're talking about. His earlier contributions were naive and his latter ones repetitive. His peak arguments are much better though.
Pratters
Cricket, Lovely Cricket
Beyond a point, you have to look beyond the longevity really. Kapil took 434 wickets which is more than a Marshall or a Donald , say. Most would rate Marshall higher.
Lara v Tendulkar is also like that. Tendulkar had a longer career but they both had fairly long careers, so you look at how good the player was more than how long they played.
Smith plays a few more years, say 4-5 more years, we are going to look at whom you would rather have in the XI rather than pure stats.
Also, if some one picks Smith ahead of SRT even right now, there is no harm in that. Smith is ****ing awesome.
Lara v Tendulkar is also like that. Tendulkar had a longer career but they both had fairly long careers, so you look at how good the player was more than how long they played.
Smith plays a few more years, say 4-5 more years, we are going to look at whom you would rather have in the XI rather than pure stats.
Also, if some one picks Smith ahead of SRT even right now, there is no harm in that. Smith is ****ing awesome.
Daemon
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There’s no way Smith’s done enough to warrant being ahead of Tendulkar at this stage imo, but the idea that 120 tests of averaging 65 would put him just on par with Tendulkar doesn’t sit right.
Lara ‘only’ played 130 tests and averaged roughly the same as Tendulkar. Why are they then spoken about in the same breath? Shouldn’t he have averaged about 60 to be considered on par?
Lara ‘only’ played 130 tests and averaged roughly the same as Tendulkar. Why are they then spoken about in the same breath? Shouldn’t he have averaged about 60 to be considered on par?
Pratters
Cricket, Lovely Cricket
Smith has a 26-29 conversion rate, scores big runs and wins you crucial series with series defining runs. It's not like he has just played a few tests or been around for 2-3 years. Made his debut 10 years back. Also, in the beginning, he was mainly selected as a bowler. Dude is best I have seen bar none. Maybe Lara and Smith but no one else in last 30 years in same breath.
Pratters
Cricket, Lovely Cricket
His come back after the ban in the Ashes was quite epic. This not done enough is what I don't buy. It's not like he has played 30 tests or over 4 consecutive years or some thing. If he was to retire in a year due to whatever reasons, you couldnt brush him aside like a Barry Richards. He has had a fairly substantial career already.