The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[stephen]

I mean for an automated algorithm it did a pretty good job but there are definitely some anomalies on that list.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Was Harris a better bowler than Walsh? Probably.

Hope this catches on

 

[Logan]

Ryan Harris played 27 Tests while Walsh played 131 Tests.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Actually Harris played 27 Tests after Walsh played 131 Tests

 

[OverratedSanity]

Harris would be considered the australian Zaheer khan if he'd been picked earlier in his career. Dude would've averaged 35 for a decade and ended up with 250 wickets @ 30. Ridiculously overrated.

 

[stephen]

Ryan Harris played 27 Tests while Walsh played 131 Tests.

That's my point. At some point longevity comes into play. Walsh played a lot more tests than Harris and is therefore rated more highly on most all time lists than other bowlers who played for less time but were better. The strongest argument is Bishop. He was Walsh's contemporary and a better bowler than him but most people place Walsh higher on their lists.

 

[TheJediBrah]

If Harris was picked earlier in his career he'd have been lucky to average below 50 in Tests. He was barely First class standard. Not really relevant though IMO

 

[stephen]

If Harris was picked earlier in his career he'd have been lucky to average below 50 in Tests. He was barely First class standard. Not really relevant though IMO

Yeah he was petty ordinary down in SA where they were trying to make him a passable all rounder. He only got gud once he came to Queensland and learned how to bowl quick.

 

[_00_deathscar]

Spiced rum sounds good. But yeah Walsh is not an atg. Never said that. He certainly wouldn't be in a WI first XI, much less a world XI. If he were say from NZ or India he might possibly be in their XI. He's still a great though which imo is above the very goods like: Gillespie, Vaas, Botham, Johnson etc.

He'd walk into the New Zealand XI but at least you'd have an argument I suppose.
"He might possibly be in their [India] XI"? What? There's no possibly about it.

 

[vcs]

Harris would be considered the australian Zaheer khan if he'd been picked earlier in his career. Dude would've averaged 35 for a decade and ended up with 250 wickets @ 30. Ridiculously overrated.

Yep, people are being so glib about the value of longevity, especially for a fast bowler.

Walsh/Anderson >>> Ryan Harris

 

[TheJediBrah]

Yep, people are being so glib about the value of longevity, especially for a fast bowler.

Walsh/Anderson >>> Ryan Harris

Not saying I disagree, but that is purely subjective. If someone decides to rate someone who was only good for a couple of years as the best bowler ever because they were legitimately that good for a short period of time then there's nothing wrong with that opinion.

 

[vcs]

Yeah, it's an opinion, and obviously no opinion on a subjective matter such as this is objectively wrong.

It has about as much worth as Burgey's theory about "WC Finals are the only ODIs that count" though.

 

[mr_mister]

Longevity arguments are just used to claim Sachin > Bradman mainly

 

[trundler]

Longevity arguments are just used to claim Sachin > Bradman mainly

You may not be suggesting this but the idea that Sachin only has longevity to brag about compared to other great batsmen is a chimp-brained take that needs to die out quickly.

 

[Logan]

Bradman is too good to be compared to anyone.

What does longevity mean? Years or matches?

Cook played 161 Tests in 12 years.

Chanderpaul played 164 Tests in 21 years.

 

[ankitj]

Not saying I disagree, but that is purely subjective. If someone decides to rate someone who was only good for a couple of years as the best bowler ever because they were legitimately that good for a short period of time then there's nothing wrong with that opinion.

Yeah, but based on that if anyone suggested Waqar > McGrath, expect an epic meltdown.

EDIT: I mean a suggestion that even Imran is good replacement for McGrath in an ATGI XI even as an overall package causes lot of heartache on here.

 

[TheJediBrah]

You may not be suggesting this but the idea that Sachin only has longevity to brag about compared to other great batsmen is a chimp-brained take that needs to die out quickly.

It is when you're comparing him to Bradman

 

[Logan]

I mean a suggestion that even Imran is good replacement for McGrath in an ATGI XI even as an overall package causes lot of heartache on here.

Glen McGrath is a Top 5 bowler of all time IMO.

Imran Khan is a Top 10 bowler of all time IMO, a decent batsman and arguably the greatest captain of all time.

My ATG team has three pure bowlers(Marshall, Steyn and Murali) and two bowling all rounders(Imran and Hadlee).

 

[Flem274*]

courtney walsh is an atg

james anderson is an atvg

ryan harris bowled at an atg level over a short career. he suffers in career analysis but when looking at individual matches he had the impact you would expect from any 10 year career atg bowler.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Glen McGrath is a Top 5 bowler of all time IMO.

Imran Khan is a Top 10 bowler of all time IMO, a decent batsman and arguably the greatest captain of all time.

My ATG team has three pure bowlers(Marshall, Steyn and Murali) and two bowling all rounders(Imran and Hadlee).

ok