Virat Kohli, the greatest ODI bat ever?

[vcs]

Ponting was Ponting. Until Kohli came around he was the best #3 since Viv. Taking Lara's peak and comparing it with Ponting's entire career is biased to start with. Lara was great in the first half and only decent in the second. Ponting was pretty awesome throughout and peaked higher. Obviously wasn't up to it in the last few years but that quarter final century was fantastic. Which brings me to my final point, nothing Lara did in ODIs compares to Ponting's best ODI innings. It's hardly a debate. Ponting slam dunks it.

That's not true, Lara's hundred against SA in '96 was a true classic. I didn't watch the '03 hundred against the same opposition who were the hosts, but I'm sure it would have been good. Early '90s ODI Lara was very good indeed though he got overshadowed by Sachin towards the end of the decade.

Look at his average in this extremely low scoring series vs. those bowling attacks..

Total International Series, 1992/93 Cricket Team Records & Stats | ESPNcricinfo.com

Also, his knock in this match where Basit Ali randomly went crazy sticks in my mind because it was rare to see such things in the early '90s.

Full Scorecard of Pakistan vs West Indies, Sharjah Champions Trophy, Final - Score Report | ESPNcricinfo.com

Ponting was probably better overall with longevity, relentless consistency etc., but it was closer than you're making it sound.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Richie Richardson, 15 off 50 balls in a run chase of 285 in an ODI in the 90s is worth noting.

 

[Bolo]

Ponting was probably better overall with longevity, relentless consistency etc., but it was closer than you're making it sound.

Not everyone gives much consideration to these factors in ranking players either. If you think Ponting was a much better test bat than, say, Younis Khan, it's worth asking why Ponting is a better ODI bat than Lara.

For me though, there is one extra thing that sets Ponting apart from statistically similar bats in odis- his ability to build and pace an innings. He's well ahead of top order bats from his era in this regard.

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Lara and Ponting , both played 18 years .
If we divide it to 3 equal parts.. it looks like this.

1990-1995
Lara 44 at 75 plus
1995 - 2000
Ponting 40 at 72 plus

1996-2001
Lara 41 at 83
2001-2006
43 at 84

2002 - 2007
Lara 36.6 at 81
2007-2012
Ponting 43 at 83

Considering era differences ,

Lara first 6 yrs way better than Ponting first 6 yrs

Lara middle 6 yrs = Ponting middle 6yrs

Ponting final 6 yrs better than Lara final 6 yrs.

Or ,

Lara first 6 yrs > Ponting middle 6 yrs
Lara middle 6yrs > Ponting final 6 yrs
Lara final 6 yrs = Ponting first 6 yrs


It's a statistical comparison , there are many other things to consider. But here , one thing is clear, Lara peaked early in the career and that provides a false impression on his consistency. Certainly there is no gulf between him and Ponting in that regard.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

The gulf between Lara and Ponting is that one is right handed and the other left handed.

 

[TheJediBrah]

I'd rate Lara much higher if he didn't have the voice of a pre-pubescent 9 year old boy on estrogen

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

I'd rate Lara much higher if he didn't have the voice of a pre-pubescent 9 year old boy on estrogen

Sachin is even more pre-pubescent on estrogen.

 

[GoodAreasShane]

Always found the voice of Chris Gayle a contrast to pretty much everything about him.

Mitch Johnson too, even to this day he still tends to sound nervous when speaking, seems odd for someone who could bowl 150 at the skull

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Always found the voice of Chris Gayle a contrast to pretty much everything about him.

Mitch Johnson too, even to this day he still tends to sound nervous when speaking, seems odd for someone who could bowl 150 at the skull

Ever hear Shakib speak?

 

[GoodAreasShane]

Ever hear Shakib speak?

Yeah, I see what you mean, but for what is not his native language Shakib speaks alright imo

 

[TheJediBrah]

Always found the voice of Chris Gayle a contrast to pretty much everything about him.

Mitch Johnson too, even to this day he still tends to sound nervous when speaking, seems odd for someone who could bowl 150 at the skull

Yeah Chris Gayle is even worse than Lara. Must be weird to hang out with him by a pool with 2 models on each arm and then he opens his mouth and starts talking with that voice.

 

[Borges]

Certainly there is no gulf between him and Ponting in that regard.

There is no gulf between the two. But looking at their entire ODI careers, I think it is fair to rate Ponting slightly higher than Lara.

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

There is no gulf between the two. But looking at their entire ODI careers, I think it is fair to rate Ponting slightly higher than Lara.

I was talking about consistency.
Overall I rate Lara higher.
That 47 AVG was insane in 90s .

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

ESPN last 25 years ODi 11

Specialist Batsmen - Sachin , Kohli , ABDV , Dhoni and Lara
( same as my top 5 in last 25 years )

Lara selection over Ponting and Bevan was surprising.

 

[Malcolm]

Lara selection over Ponting and Bevan was surprising.

Sachin, Kohli, Abdv, Dhoni are all right handers. So it's better to have a lefty in the middle order.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Sachin, Kohli, Abdv, Dhoni are all right handers. So it's better to have a lefty in the middle order.

Good observation.

Just like the England team with Eoin Morgan.

 

[Bolo]

There's also the fact that the team is junk. 2 keepers, kallis, and Warne as a second spinner

 

[Malcolm]

There's also the fact that the team is junk.

Truth.

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

There's also the fact that the team is junk. 2 keepers, kallis, and Warne as a second spinner

2 keepers - nothing to complain about. It's Dhoni and Gilly.

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Sachin, Kohli, Abdv, Dhoni are all right handers. So it's better to have a lefty in the middle order.

Probably , but Lara was already there and the competition for the final spot was between ponting and dhoni.