Baggy Green ball tampering: Bancroft, Smith and the Aussie "Leadership Group"

[vic_orthdox]

SA known for rubbing the ball against the zip on the pockets of their pants to rough it up. Warned about throwing the ball into the ground too often. Every team has their tricks to rough the ball up quicker, it’s just that Australia went “desperate” being behind in the test and got caught.

 

[NZTailender]

I actually think Smith will be welcomed back by most of the cricketing public (as distinct from the wider public who think that ball tampering is a form of mass murder) and certainly the team

Warner however I don't think is perceived as a contrite or remorseful kind of guy, so will find the way back harder - from a selection, team, and public perspective

If the purported version of events is true - Warner the mastermind with newbie Bancroft backing him up and approved by Smith - it can be written off as stupid, an error of judgement, was under pressure, a whole raft of reasons. That can lead to forgiveness.

That's if we take everything at face value, though.

 

[social]

Would be surprised if SA have moved from something that's worked and is looked on more favorably (ball shining via mints etc), to something entirely more dubious.

From all the aspersions cast at other teams tampering with the ball - they seem more concerned with keeping it shiny rather than roughing it up.

It's ball tampering all the same

 

[Larwood's_boots]

one wonders if Smith's admission of guilt was four dimensional chess designed to rid the team of Warner.

Boody hell, this is getting better than Game of Thrones...

 

[NZTailender]

It's ball tampering all the same

This will end up being a circular argument but ball shining is not really tampering.

 

[social]

This will end up being a circular argument but ball shining is not really tampering.

It is when you use mints, etc to increase its effectiveness

Trescothick admitted same while, on the other hand, Faf is simply trying to downplay it to take the heat off him

 

[Larwood's_boots]

ball shining is not really tampering.

Clearly different

 

[Larwood's_boots]

Clearly different

Different to 'ball damaging' anyway, guess they could both be technically classed as tampering.

 

[stephen]

Yeah you're unfairly tampering with the shiny side instead of the rough side.

 

[NZTailender]

It is when you use mints, etc to increase its effectiveness

Trescothick admitted same while, on the other hand, Faf is simply trying to downplay it to take the heat off him

This is where it's always fallen under a grey area - i.e. introducing foreign objects versus 'natural resources' i.e. saliva - but the saliva has been influenced by the sugar, a foreign object. Where do you draw the line?

Personally, I have no problems with someone using mints or sweat to try and shine a ball. It's a much slower process, and can be undone by someone whacking the ball into the stands, and the shine being scuffed by hitting concrete, etc. The process takes overs and overs and overs to achieve, and even then it might not work.

On the other hand, roughing the ball up with a bottle top can have near immediate effects, as Chris Pringle found out - though ironically not in Australia's case with their makeshift sandpaper. Once the shine is dulled or gone, you can't really shine it back. Roughing is more permanent.

 

[howardj]

Maybe the ICC should step in an say that nobody can do anything to the ball other than the designated ball shiner

Sort of like how AFL teams have to nominate a single ruckman at a stoppage

That way, the nominated guy knows that the cameras are on him and that everything falls back on him

 

[MagicPoopShovel]

Maybe the ICC should step in an say that nobody can do anything to the ball other than the designated ball shiner

Sort of like how AFL teams have to nominate a single ruckman at a stoppage

That way, the nominated guy knows that the cameras are on him and that everything falls back on him

Put some tracker inside the ball and add one these cameras to the broadcast camera line up
https://www.skydio.com/

Direct feed to the 3rd umpire/match ref.

Done.

 

[NZTailender]

Maybe the ICC should step in an say that nobody can do anything to the ball other than the designated ball shiner

Sort of like how AFL teams have to nominate a single ruckman at a stoppage

That way, the nominated guy knows that the cameras are on him and that everything falls back on him

This is a bit like there being a clean name on the liquor licence instead of it being the drug dealer himself. Cameras focused on 'the shiner', but it's actually the third set of hands on the way back to the bowler who does the deed.


(been re-watching The Wire again)

 

[howardj]

I think it's an important issue for the game as (particularly in the more abrasive conditions) teams are obsessed with reverse swing

I'm actually shocked it's only a Level 2 offence

 

[NZTailender]

I think it's an important issue for the game as (particularly in the more abrasive conditions) teams are obsessed with reverse swing

I'm actually shocked it's only a Level 2 offence

It's one of those evolving things. Each time you clarify what's ok, someone pushes the boundaries with something else.

Seems like everyone has de-facto accepted shining via saliva (mints) and sweat (sunscreen) seems alright. Roughing via other means not so much. Zippers, sandpaper and bottle caps a no-no. Personally don't have any problems with throwing the ball in and letting it bounce first as it's leaving it more up to chance than directly scratching on the ball.

The ICC actually needs to sit down with players and bowlers alike, identify the most commonly used methods, draw a more defined circle around it, and shake hands.

 

[Larwood's_boots]

This is a bit like there being a clean name on the liquor licence instead of it being the drug dealer himself. Cameras focused on 'the shiner', but it's actually the third set of hands on the way back to the bowler who does the deed.


(been re-watching The Wire again)

So in this scenario Bancroft is Wallace and Warner is String right? Fanie De Villiers becomes Prezbulowski for sure.

 

[The Hutt Rec]

That last presser just fuelled more controversies. Basically shooting themselves in the foot

Yeah it was another PR disaster for Cricket Australia. They’ve handled this really poorly.

 

[howardj]

I agree NZT

The movement of the ball has had such a profound effect on the Series

Starc destroyed SA when he got the ball to move

But in the 3rd Test, the ball hardly did anything and the Aussies struggled

 

[howardj]

Yeah it was another PR disaster for Cricket Australia. They’ve handled this really poorly.

Sutherland has no feel for the mood.

I think his position really needs to be looked at.

He gave Smith a dressing down about team standards after the 1st Test, and obviously had no impact at all.

What keeps him in the job is that Australian cricket has been revived under his watch with the Big Bash.

 

[NZTailender]

So in this scenario Bancroft is Wallace and Warner is String right? Fanie De Villiers becomes Prezbulowski for sure.

Nominated ball-shiner would be Orlando (just runs a 'clean' business), while the dude orchestrating the dirty is Stringer or Avon.

So Bancroft would be Orlando and Warner Stringer - except Stringer was smart. Maybe he's Bird.