Adam Voges average watch

[cnerd123]

Makes me want to cry given I thought that line-up was one of Australia's weakest ever. Why can't England have nice things? The three lions have mustered a single batsman with a 50+ average (Root) since 1970. Australia in the same period have had 8 batsmen.

England is a hard place to average >50 in and English cricketers play most of their cricket there.
Same would apply to South Africa I imagine.

 

[Gob]

England is a hard place to average >50 in and English cricketers play most of their cricket there.
Same would apply to South Africa I imagine.

Didn't stop 9 visiting batsmen averaging over 50 there.

Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPN Cricinfo

Don't think England produced that many quality bats compared to Aus, SA, India in that period imo

 

[GIMH]

Didn't stop 9 visiting batsmen averaging over 50 there.

Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPN Cricinfo

Don't think England produced that many quality bats compared to Aus, SA, India in that period imo

Five of our own average 50 in England in that time period, just for a bit of balance.

If you look at the non-England players above 50 in that time, they are some of the absolute greats of that game. Other top names like Lara and Ponting fall short. Kind of bears the original theory out to an extent.

 

[TheJediBrah]

England is a hard place to average >50 in and English cricketers play most of their cricket there.
Same would apply to South Africa I imagine.

this is a bit of a myth IMO

and South Africa isn't any harder to score than most other places, pretty much the same as Aus (excluding the last couple of years)

 

[GIMH]

this is a bit of a myth IMO

and South Africa isn't any harder to score than most other places, pretty much the same as Aus (excluding the last couple of years)

I cbf to look up the stats but would be surprised if average scores in England weren't lower than elsewhere, though granted the London grounds may make that not the case

 

[AndrewB]

Quick copy-and-paste from Cricinfo of overall batting averages by host country since 2000:

35.04 in Pakistan
34.32 in Australia
33.71 in India
33.53 in U.A.E
32.85 in Bangladesh
31.58 in England
31.47 in New Zealand
31.23 in Sri Lanka
30.86 in West Indies
30.60 in South Africa
30.41 in Zimbabwe

 

[TheJediBrah]

Quick copy-and-paste from Cricinfo of overall batting averages by host country since 2000:

35.04 in Pakistan
34.32 in Australia
33.71 in India
33.53 in U.A.E
32.85 in Bangladesh
31.58 in England
31.47 in New Zealand
31.23 in Sri Lanka
30.86 in West Indies
30.60 in South Africa
30.41 in Zimbabwe

I'm somewhat surprised that there doesn't seem to be much difference

 

[OverratedSanity]

this is a bit of a myth IMO

and South Africa isn't any harder to score than most other places, pretty much the same as Aus (excluding the last couple of years)

South Africa definitely seems a bit harder if we go purely by batting averages though. I think all of Graeme Smith, Amla, AB, and most other South African batsmen, really, average low to mid 40s in SA(or atleast they did when I looked up this statistic a few years ago to make the same point) , considerably below their career averages.

 

[Senile Sentry]

Five of our own average 50 in England in that time period, just for a bit of balance.

If you look at the non-England players above 50 in that time, they are some of the absolute greats of that game. Other top names like Lara and Ponting fall short. Kind of bears the original theory out to an extent.

You are right, all the more indicates to England just producing some good but not great batsmen eventually who couldn't score heavily away from their country enough to classify as greats.

It is testimony to England's team culture and discipline that without producing so called individual greats it has managed to be up there among the top 3-4 always (except for 90s). Almost a soccer like approach with a centralized team management dictating. No wonder the KPs never got traction in such an environment.

 

[TheJediBrah]

You are right, all the more indicates to England just producing some good but not great batsmen eventually who couldn't score heavily away from their country enough to classify as greats.

It is testimony to England's team culture and discipline that without producing so called individual greats it has managed to be up there among the top 3-4 always (except for 90s). Almost a soccer like approach with a centralized team management dictating. No wonder the KPs never got traction in such an environment.

Probably more so that he was an insufferable egomaniac that a large proportion in the team and management couldn't stand being around than because he was an "individual great"

just saying

 

[Senile Sentry]

Probably more so that he was an insufferable egomaniac that a large proportion in the team and management couldn't stand being around than because he was an "individual great"

just saying

Or simply, he was a genius who was also human enough to have his thoughts and say in what goes around him, and was not a robot.

 

[Coronis]

Probably more so that he was an insufferable egomaniac that a large proportion in the team and management couldn't stand being around than because he was an "individual great"

just saying

His official website does say Kevin Pietersen MBE in the title. Sounds about right.

 

[Tangles]

I would have initially thought Voges would only be allowed one bad series given his age. His current form probably means he has more rope than that though. That will play into his final average. If he is allowed to have enough tests at a lower return then that brings him back to the pack.

 

[Captain_Cook]

England is a hard place to average >50 in and English cricketers play most of their cricket there.

30 players have played >20 innings and averaged 50 since 1970. Just to be clear 17 players averaged 50 after 20 before 1970. However, 8 of them were English (more than any other team).

England have had a really dearth in top quality batsmen since 1970. Is that to do with lack of training or is this just the cyclical nature about how talent is unearthed.

 

[Shady Slim]

His official website does say Kevin Pietersen MBE in the title. Sounds about right.

pietersen's saga was handled abhorrently by the management though

like even if you don't think he should have been allowed back strauss saying "you are not playing for my team but can be an advisor" is stupid

i saw a guy rephrase it as "you are not driving my car but you can teach by kids"

not good from either party though because pietersen did waaaaaah exceedingly

 

[marc71178]

His official website does say Kevin Pietersen MBE in the title. Sounds about right.

Only surprise is it isn't Kevin Pietersen ME ME ME.

 

[91Jmay]

pietersen's saga was handled abhorrently by the management though

like even if you don't think he should have been allowed back strauss saying "you are not playing for my team but can be an advisor" is stupid

i saw a guy rephrase it as "you are not driving my car but you can teach by kids"

not good from either party though because pietersen did waaaaaah exceedingly

I take it you aren't familiar with driving instructors then?

 

[91Jmay]

Middx 304/6d (102.5 ov, JEC Franklin 30*, TR Ambrose 1/0) - Match over | Live Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo

Found his weakness.

 

[Bijed]

Middx 304/6d (102.5 ov, JEC Franklin 30*, TR Ambrose 1/0) - Match over | Live Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo

Found his weakness.

Haha, for ages I was reading it as 'c Ambrose, b Barker' and wondering what you meant, then suddenly it clicked. Not a bad maiden first-class wicket to get.

England to pick Ambrose for the next ashes just to neutralise Voges

 

[TheJediBrah]

Get Trott back in the team IMO

If you have to only let him play home games and rest him against scary opposition like Australia then so be it