Is Chris Gayle some sort of perverted misogynist or can everyone just settle down?

[OverratedSanity]

Only saving grace of this thread is no Blocky

 

[Dan]

See this is completely inside your own mind.

I can totally reverse that on you. Making posts about how someone should post on a forum is always so dodgy. Suggestive of a paternalistic "I know best" type mindset, which always leaves a lot to be desired.

I have made countless posts on this forum on a range of topics, about how a player should bat, how a team should play, about how a director should have made a movie. I have never been accused of any of this before. The only reason this is happening is because it involved a woman this time. This is how difficult it is to have a genuine conversation on these topics if you have a slightly different perspective. I have now lost my 'gender equality' credentials apparently.

There is a huge difference between discussing how people should undertake tasks, and how people should emotionally react to things. If you really don't see a difference between policing a person's emotional reaction to that kind of situation, and critiquing batting technique, I'm not sure how you can even hope to have a genuine conversation on this in the first place.

 

[Black_Warrior]

I never said any of those things. I asked why you get to tell Mel McLaughlin that she should have laughed it off. You're completely denying her actual experience (whatever that experience actually was) by attempting to police her reaction.

I'm superficially sympathetic to the notion of not labelling it '***ual harassment'. Not in any defence of what Gayle did, but for the point that OS raised about trivialising 'actual' ***ual harassment. However, doing that strikes me as a classic case of the whataboutery that Spark was talking about ("there's worse so this isn't real ***ual harassment"), and three men are contributing to a definition of what constitutes ***ual harassment and are policing how actual victims and actual women use that term.

Once more, I'm not quite sure why you (or I, for that matter) get to tell women what is or is not ***ual harassment. Hence, up until now I've tried to avoid commenting on that side of the debate.

You or I get to tell just as much as we get to tell Dhoni when he should retire, or PCB whether they should allow Amir or not, which is basically 90% of the conversations on this forum which ultimately has no bearing in the actual event.
McLaughlin is ultimately a free individual and will act in a way she sees fit, just like the cricketers we post on this forum will act in the way they see fit.

However, if this is how you feel, then why do we even have a topic on this matter? We don't get to talk about this matter right? So let's close the topic? Or only those who have a certain view are allowed to post on this thread?

And there is no way that McLaughlin should be blamed in any way, shape, or form for the backlash against Gayle. Gayle did what he did, and he has to cop the consequences of that. McLaughlin is in no way responsible for that, and suggesting that she is responsible is the absolute height of stupidity and arrogance (especially since she'd basically said nothing after the fact)

And that's what I said. I was criticising the backlash, and I had an inkling that people would insinuate that I am blaming her for the backlash so decided to add "not saying she should be blamed" but people went ahead and did that anyway.

 

[sledger]

Only saving grace of this thread is no Blocky

What we need is Honest Bharani in here so he can deny that Gayle said the things he did. No matter how much evidence to the contrary is provided.

 

[sledger]

You or I get to tell just as much as we get to tell Dhoni when he should retire, or PCB whether they should allow Amir or not, which is basically 90% of the conversations on this forum which ultimately has no bearing in the actual event.
McLaughlin is ultimately a free individual and will act in a way she sees fit, just like the cricketers we post on this forum will act in the way they see fit.

However, if this is how you feel, then why do we even have a topic on this matter? We don't get to talk about this matter right? So let's close the topic? Or only those who have a certain view are allowed to post on this thread?



And that's what I said. I was criticising the backlash, and I had an inkling that people would insinuate that I am blaming her for the backlash so decided to add "not saying she should be blamed" but people went ahead and did that anyway.

stahp

 

[Dan]

Are you seriously saying this? That means I don't get to speak about this issue because of my gender? Ok.

You can discuss the issue all you want. You can hold the opinion that this isn't ***ist. You're wrong, but you're entitled to that opinion. That doesn't mean you get to tell Mel McLaughlin what she should think, when she has actually experienced this and you well and truly have not.

You. Do. Not. Get. To. Deny. Other. People's. Experiences.

 

[Black_Warrior]

There is a huge difference between discussing how people should undertake tasks, and how people should emotionally react to things. If you really don't see a difference between policing a person's emotional reaction to that kind of situation, and critiquing batting technique, I'm not sure how you can even hope to have a genuine conversation on this in the first place.

We don't always just comment on batting technique here. There are a lot of other subjects (cricketing and non cricketing) with moral and emotional implications we comment on.

And I am no batting expert, nor have I ever played cricket at any professional level? So why do I get to comment on how an international batsman should bat?

 

[Gnske]

You're better when you're not posting about social issues and instead desperately trying to make "meme team" a thing

Aaah I get the saltiness at me for all these months now.I called your team meme didn't I? I'm sorry. But that's still a meme thing to say to me.




Think the thread has outlived its use-by date now lads.

 

[Dan]

There's a huge difference between a debate over whether or not this is ***ist or ***ual harassment or misogynistic or whatever, and whether or not Mel McLaughlin found (or should find) it to be ***ist/***ual harassment/misogynistic. You're well and truly conflating the two here.

 

[sledger]

We don't always just comment on batting technique here. There are a lot of other subjects (cricketing and non cricketing) with moral and emotional implications we comment on.

And I am no batting expert, nor have I ever played cricket at any professional level? So why do I get to comment on how an international batsman should bat?

Haha do you honestly not get the distinction to be made here? I entertained the possibility that you might be trolling us at first; now I'm suspecting that your views on these matters are just dangerously poor.

 

[Pratters]

Mel McLaughlin can be replaced with any woman or person doing their job. It's not appropriate to start harassing and making another person uncomfortable while they are doing the same.

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

Aaah I get the saltiness at me for all these months now.I called your team meme didn't I? I'm sorry. But that's still a meme thing to say to me.

Haha you think you're relevant.

 

[Dan]

I liked the piece because it spells out the key issues of 'power' and 'equaliy'. I think that it was Gayles attempt to disempower his intervierer by the use of ***ualised language, and therefore deny her equality, that ultimately make his actions punishable. The crassness is neither here nor there as context is everything.

Black Warrior of course intuitively understands this idea of 'power' and 'equality', and therefore assumes that this is just another example of white people putting down black people. Apparently, it's a case of racism trumping ***ism.

You don't get to tell Black_Warrior what Black_Warrior thinks either.

 

[Stapel]

There is a huge difference between discussing how people should undertake tasks, and how people should emotionally react to things. If you really don't see a difference between policing a person's emotional reaction to that kind of situation, and critiquing batting technique, I'm not sure how you can even hope to have a genuine conversation on this in the first place.

I can see both your points and I think the both of you are overreacting.

In BW's defense: Many of the remarks made in this thread seem quite paternalistic to me.

For FSM's sake. This whole thread is a bit overcooked, imho.

Two general notes, just to take this incident out of a general problem that exists all over the world:

For those who think ***ism isn't that much of a problem, try, as a first step, going out to a gay bar for a night. I know, not quite the same, but it probably does teach you a thing or two.

For those who think it was really bad was CHG did, get yourself into a decent and proper conversation with any woman on this subject. There are far far worse examples of ***ism around. Every day again.

 

[Gnske]

Haha you think you're relevant.

Must be, you've reserved so much time to reply to just about anything I spew.

 

[sledger]

I can see both your points and I think the both of you are overreacting.

In BW's defense: Many of the remarks made in this thread seem quite paternalistic to me.

For FSM's sake. This whole thread is a bit overcooked, imho.

Two general notes, just to take this incident out of a general problem that exists all over the world:

For those who think ***ism isn't that much of a problem, try, as a first step, going out to a gay bar for a night. I know, not quite the same, but it probably does teach you a thing or two.

For those who think it was really bad was CHG did, get yourself into a decent and proper conversation with any woman on this subject. There are far far worse examples of ***ism around. Every day again.

This is no mitigation.

 

[91Jmay]

There was a proper conversation posted earlier in the thread between two women who felt it was a really bad thing CG did, so that argument is null and void.

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

Ah yes, the "things could be worse so you can't complain" argument.

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

Must be, you've reserved so much time to reply to just about anything I spew.

Takes like 30 seconds. I'm a really good poster you see.

 

[Stapel]

This is no mitigation.

Agreed.

Yet this incident gets a lot of people overcooked, whereas this doesn't seem to be the case on many other occasion