Mohammed Amir cleared to return with immediate effect

[Black_Warrior]

Eh bowling deliberate no-balls isn't the same as fixing the result of the game. Bowl one bad ball, get it done with, then resume your match-winning efforts.

But that is exactly the problem. The priority should be to attempt to bowl as well as he can, to win his team the game. If he's bowling a deliberate bad ball, then he is not doing that.

Anyway, i don't really want to open up the debate on that incident. Everything that had to be said has already been said.

 

[cnerd123]

Calling winning the game a 'distant' second priority is completely misrepresenting it.

For a handful of balls, like 1% of his entire bowling contribution of the game, his goal was to overstep.

For the remaining 99% he still bowled to win.

You can get on your principled high horse that 'fixing is fixing' and be done with that, or you could be a bit more nuanced with your criticism and understand that Amir doesn't belong in the same bracket as men like Cairns and Cronje.

 

[GIMH]

Calling winning the game a 'distant' second priority is completely misrepresenting it.

For a handful of balls, like 1% of his entire bowling contribution of the game, his goal was to overstep.

For the remaining 99% he still bowled to win.

You can get on your principled high horse that 'fixing is fixing' and be done with that, or you could be a bit more nuanced with your criticism and understand that Amir doesn't belong in the same bracket as men like Cairns and Cronje.

But what if he'd got Trott out with a no ball?

 

[honestbharani]

I just wish it dawned on people that the only reason match fixing had given way to spot-fixing was that the bookies and the crooks found out that it is very very difficult to actually "fix" a match result and it is much easier and simpler to manipulate individual events like balls and overs. We keep talking about how a game can change in one ball and to me, deliberately underperforming for certain "stretches" of the game is the same as fixing the game's result. You do it often enough, you can ensure that your team loses. And fixing spots individuals raises the stakes for the betting groups and thus raises the rewards stakes for those involved from the inside. It is high time we gave up viewing it as some sort of a lesser crime.

 

[Fusion]

But what if he'd got Trott out with a no ball?

Even if that happened and it contributed to Pakistan losing the match, Amir still wasn't actively trying to lose like a match fixer. Though both spot fixing and match fixing are grievous offenses, there is still a distinction in my mind between the two and match fixing is certainly the more unforgivable crime to me.

 

[harsh.ag]

Even if that happened and it contributed to Pakistan losing the match, Amir still wasn't actively trying to lose like a match fixer. Though both spot fixing and match fixing are grievous offenses, there is still a distinction in my mind between the two and match fixing is certainly the more unforgivable crime to me.

Though it may very well be the case that he would have agreed to do match fixing as well had the opportunity been available, and it wasn't only because the bookies prefer spot fixing now.

 

[Fusion]

If he had, the punishment would've been harsher. You can't go by what could have happened, only by what did happen.

 

[honestbharani]

Even if that happened and it contributed to Pakistan losing the match, Amir still wasn't actively trying to lose like a match fixer. Though both spot fixing and match fixing are grievous offenses, there is still a distinction in my mind between the two and match fixing is certainly the more unforgivable crime to me.

The only reason the bookies stopped trying to fix matches was because they figured it was not always bankable even if you have like the half side in it... Hence they went into the subtler and yet equally detestable spot fixing area.

 

[sledger]

Yeah look, I'm all for throwing the book at Amir for what he did, but the idea he should be punished for something that could have happened (but categorically did not happen) is nonsense.

 

[sledger]

That said, in my mind, match fixing (in its traditional definition) and spot fixing are basically the same thing anyway, so it's a moot point.

 

[nightprowler10]

I would take a crap player trying to play on his uncle's connections any day over someone for whom winning a test match in England is only a distant second on the priority list.

Yes, keeping a legit talent out of the line-up because of your connections and family wealth is not akin to cheating and does not hurt the team's chances of winning, at all.

 

[fredfertang]

That said, in my mind, match fixing (in its traditional definition) and spot fixing are basically the same thing anyway, so it's a moot point.

The victims are the same

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

Q: Should Amir be allowed to play cricket?

Yes Or No

 

[GIMH]

Even if that happened and it contributed to Pakistan losing the match, Amir still wasn't actively trying to lose like a match fixer. Though both spot fixing and match fixing are grievous offenses, there is still a distinction in my mind between the two and match fixing is certainly the more unforgivable crime to me.

No but it's an action where his intentions where not in the interest of his team

I think hb has nailed this one tbh

 

[Furball]

I think hb has nailed this one tbh

 

[GIMH]

 

[hendrix]

Even if that happened and it contributed to Pakistan losing the match, Amir still wasn't actively trying to lose like a match fixer. Though both spot fixing and match fixing are grievous offenses, there is still a distinction in my mind between the two and match fixing is certainly the more unforgivable crime to me.

It's not intuitive, but the actual victims of the crimes are the same.

 

[smash84]

It's not intuitive, but the actual victims of the crimes are the same.

the bookies?

 

[hendrix]

the bookies?

Yes the bookies, but also the gamblers and their families, the investors in the bookmaking companies, the employees of the companies who make the odds based on statistical research, the credibility of the economy, the credibility of the sport.

It's not really any different than stealing from a bank. Serious, broadranging outcomes.

 

[Black_Warrior]

Yes, keeping a legit talent out of the line-up because of your connections and family wealth is not akin to cheating and does not hurt the team's chances of winning, at all.

Yeah it's so easy to make this argument because of Faisal Iqbal and Amir's records.. Faisal is crap..so he gets all the hate..Amir is brilliant, so we look the other way.

My point is, Faisal (unless evidence proven otherwise) did everything in his limited ability to help the team's cause...can't say the same for the other guy. That's all.