Road to the 2015 Ashes in England

[Antihippy]

Watto didn't ton up and MMarsh has to retire after hitting his ton.

Is there still hope for a Watto-less ashes?

 

[Spark]

Can't see a Watto-less Ashes. Can see a Watto-light Ashes, though, one way or another.

 

[Spark]

Meanwhile, Haddin sounds like he's in terrible nick.

 

[Gob]

Meanwhile, Haddin sounds like he's in terrible nick.

Seems like he has completely forgotten how to bat since the last ashes. Can't see him going beyond the ashes

 

[Antihippy]

That's nothing new though.

Honestly I'm just looking at him as a specialist keeper. At least his keeping is still pretty good.

 

[theegyptian]

Err, you chose the wrong format bud. Rob Smyth: Must Jos Buttler keep in all formats? | Cricket | ESPN Cricinfo

Didn't know where to put this, this is probably the most relevant tour thread, as such.

I mean he's a long way from playing as specialist bat in test cricket; he's just not good enough. He might do it in time but he has plenty to prove in test cricket as a batsman. Also it's not like there is an outstanding alternative as keeper bat around at present. Sure in ODI cricket he could easily play as a specialist bat but probably in the short term he is better off keeping all the time and trying to improve that.

No-one is really gonna play 3 formats as keeper batsman for too long especially with England's schedule so there will be a decision to be made - but that should be a while down the road.

The irony will be for those chasing Buttler is that they are better off him becoming a really good test batsman because in that case he will probably slot into a number 5 bat and not keep wicket. If he averages 30 or 35 after 30 tests he won't be good enough to play as a bat but he'll probably continue as wicketkeeper at 7.

 

[Furball]

mitch marsh is likely to pick up two or three wickets tbh. i cant recall the last time watson actually picked up more than a wicket although he could do the run drying up thing better than marsh. guess it would depend on the the rest of the attack as well. if harris is to miss out i would rather have watson as the 5th bowler because starc and johnson both could leak it.

disagree with mmarsh is a better bat than watto bit. mmarsh is still pretty unproven as a batsman and there is nothing in his first class record to fall back in to. he has potential of course and a much higher ceiling but for the moment they are pretty even with watson having the advantage of experience.

I'd rather go for an unproven batsman over someone who's proven to be useless.

 

[adub]

So no questions really answered yet apart from perhaps the question of is MJ on the downslope?

Rogers v Smarsh - maybe points decision to Smarsh but not clear enough to see Rogers sitting out a third test in a row.
Twatto v Mmarsh - again a slight points decision to Marsh, but not conclusive. He certainly will have done more than enough if Watson isn't able to bowl in the next game though.
Harris v Father time and his own knees - even. Will need another gallop and a few second innings poles won't hurt here. I still have him as a lock, but another game needed to 100% confirm that.
MJ v the world - Johnson plays the first test.

Would like to see them play the same openers next game and bring Warner in at 3 to get some time in the middle, Watson, Mmarsh, Nev, Rad, Starc, Harris, Haze, Lyon for the next match. I definitely think Rad v Nev should become a live question if not for the first test then defo if he fails in the first couple. Maybe give them each an innings with the gloves. The Buck v Sos shoot out is probably Rogers' to lose, but a couple of failures and another Smarsh ton could do just that. Watson needs to bowl next game if he's to make the first test, but further good performances from Marsh might make the decision even if he is fit. For me it would come down then to Harris v Starc (with Harris starting well ahead), but a poor showing from Haze could lose him his spot.

 

[Gnske]

I'd rather go for an unproven batsman over someone who's proven to be useless.

Excuse me, Watto has Four, thats right four Test tons, an amazing feat AND at a higher average than Marsh in domestic cricket.

The guy just needs a run in the team to realize the gold within him, he's been an innings away from a triple ton for a year now, he's looked in such red hot form.

 

[NUFAN]

That's nothing new though.

Honestly I'm just looking at him as a specialist keeper. At least his keeping is still pretty good.

Haddin really isn't good enough with the gloves to be considered a specialist keeper. i honestly think that half of the state keepers are better than Rad with the gloves and it is not as though his experience is that important with such an old group around him.

In saying this, I still have faith that he can make runs in a pressure situation.

 

[Tangles]

Haze and Harris are the best 2 at following the plan to Cook and others in the channel. They both play if fit IMO.

 

[Swingpanzee]

I am still not convinced that Starc won't leak runs in a test match. Which is why I want Harris, Haze and one of Johnson/Starc (Johnson seems to have removed doubts over his selection). Also it'll be easier if both Starc and Harris play next warm-up just to see how both go on the same pitch.

 

[Red]

So no questions really answered yet apart from perhaps the question of is MJ on the downslope?

Rogers v Smarsh - maybe points decision to Smarsh but not clear enough to see Rogers sitting out a third test in a row.
Twatto v Mmarsh - again a slight points decision to Marsh, but not conclusive. He certainly will have done more than enough if Watson isn't able to bowl in the next game though.
Harris v Father time and his own knees - even. Will need another gallop and a few second innings poles won't hurt here. I still have him as a lock, but another game needed to 100% confirm that.
MJ v the world - Johnson plays the first test.

Would like to see them play the same openers next game and bring Warner in at 3 to get some time in the middle, Watson, Mmarsh, Nev, Rad, Starc, Harris, Haze, Lyon for the next match. I definitely think Rad v Nev should become a live question if not for the first test then defo if he fails in the first couple. Maybe give them each an innings with the gloves. The Buck v Sos shoot out is probably Rogers' to lose, but a couple of failures and another Smarsh ton could do just that. Watson needs to bowl next game if he's to make the first test, but further good performances from Marsh might make the decision even if he is fit. For me it would come down then to Harris v Starc (with Harris starting well ahead), but a poor showing from Haze could lose him his spot.

Reckon the next match we play should feature the XI we are pretty sure are gonna play test 1. For me, that is:

Rogers
Warner
Smith
Clarke
Voges
Watson (but MMarsh if Watson can't bowl)
Haddin (it'll be him but I'd prefer Nev)
Johnson
Harris
Hazelwood
Lyon

We should be 100% certain (barring injury) of who is our test starting XI before the last warm up match and that should be made clear to the players. Last warm up game is prep for the 1st test, and the last thing we want right before the series starts is dissent among guys over spots.

 

[Gob]

Yeah no starc should play.

 

[Red]

Yeah no starc should play.

Maybe provide some substance? Yeah no instead of whom? And why?

 

[Gob]

Maybe provide some substance? Yeah no instead of whom? And why?

err because mitch starc is likely to play a crucial role at some point of the series if not in the 1st test so its important that he keeps his match bowling form going and him playing would also allow the selectors to monitor his current upward curve with the red ball and compare how he would fare in comparison with the other quicks on the same pitch etc etc.

i don't necessarily disagree with the team that you put on for the 1st test cos that is what id run in with too but i just don't see any logic in that exact same team playing in the warmups. let starc sit on his ass without playing and all of a sudden someone roles his ankle half an hour before the first test and you are left with playing a bloke who has played no cricket on the tour or playing peter siddle.

just rest johnson

 

[Swingpanzee]

yeah don't see the logic in not playing starc for the next warm up

 

[flibbertyjibber]

I mean he's a long way from playing as specialist bat in test cricket; he's just not good enough. He might do it in time but he has plenty to prove in test cricket as a batsman. Also it's not like there is an outstanding alternative as keeper bat around at present. Sure in ODI cricket he could easily play as a specialist bat but probably in the short term he is better off keeping all the time and trying to improve that.

No-one is really gonna play 3 formats as keeper batsman for too long especially with England's schedule so there will be a decision to be made - but that should be a while down the road.

The irony will be for those chasing Buttler is that they are better off him becoming a really good test batsman because in that case he will probably slot into a number 5 bat and not keep wicket. If he averages 30 or 35 after 30 tests he won't be good enough to play as a bat but he'll probably continue as wicketkeeper at 7.

No way can he play all the matches. Happy with Bairstow as the back up to give Buttler a rest as and when they see fit to give it him. Not saying Bairstow should replace him but is a capable deputy until somebody else comes along. Not a bad position to be in knowing you have a solid pair of keeper/bats available when normally we only have one at most.

 

[adub]

Certainly don't disagree with the team Red Hill as the likely and my preferred 1st test side, but would definitely be giving Starc a bowl (MJ to rest), and probably giving at least Smitteh a rest. I realise I hadn't given Voges a run in my OP so he'd definitely play instead of Clarke, Smarsh or one of the ARs. I'd also like to see Nev get a game for the same reason as Starc. Whilst he might not be in the first test side you would want him having some time in the centre under his belt in case he needs to come in for the 2nd Test. What if say Harris and Hads pick up injuries in the fc game and can't make it to the line for Cardiff? It would make us look like dills if Starc and Nev had to come into the side with no serious warm up in the conditions.

If we were playing 3 or more fc warm ups I'd agree the last game should be the test side or as close to it as possible, but with the way things are we still have some very close decisions to make and players to get acclimatised.

 

[NUFAN]

I think next game we will see:
Warner
Rogers
Clarke
Voges
Watson
MMarsh
Nevill
Starc
Harris
Hazlewood
Lyon