vic_orthdox
Global Moderator
If they have flown Moeen over and he's not fit to bowl proper spells...wow.
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***Official*** England in West Indies 2015
- Thread starter theegyptian
- Start date
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Haha you wouldn't really put it past them though, would you?
I can just see it now -- he comes in for Tredwell and has an average game on the back of questionable fitness and morons like Botham start talking about how the selectors were made for not selecting a "specialist spinner" (even though Moeen is the better bowler) and talk about how harsh it was to drop Tredwell after "doing so well" (ie. outbowled by Root in the fourth innings when he was really needed..) in the first Test.
vic_orthdox
Global Moderator
FTR, anyone who thinks that Tredwell can bowl a side to victory when they are shutting up shop is kidding themselves. And I defend finger spinners more than most.
flibbertyjibber
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One match back after injury and he only bowled 11 overs. Is he up to bowling 50-60 or more in a test?
That would be my only doubt over him. He comes straight back in when fully fit and ready.
wellAlbidarned
International Coach
I don't think anyone picks Tredwell to bowl you to victory, but he's definitely damn useful to have in WI conditions.
vic_orthdox
Global Moderator
No, but a bit of reaction had been about Tredwell failing to do what he's been picked to do in that Test.
wellAlbidarned
International Coach
He was picked to bowl lots of economical overs and chip in with a few wickets, not take 8-40 on the 5th day. Ideally you'd pair him with a more attacking spinner to strike the finishing blow which England were lacking.
vic_orthdox
Global Moderator
Yes, I agree. The point I'm making is to those who were complaining about his performance.
As much as I'm a fan of moeen and I think he adds a lot of value as a spinning all rounder, I'm really not sure if he's really that much better at running through sides on the fourth innings as tredwell. I saw his performances against India but that was such a bizarrely poor batting performance that I can't judge it as something he can do regularly.
I put both him and tredwell on roughly the same level in utility and ability. If anything tredwell is the slightly better bowler in being able to land the ball where he wants consistently. Ironically though that's actually what gives moeen the advantage. He's so inconsistent in getting it to land on the seam that it gives him natural variation. If he can learn to vary his pace like tredwell does he can become much better.
I put both him and tredwell on roughly the same level in utility and ability. If anything tredwell is the slightly better bowler in being able to land the ball where he wants consistently. Ironically though that's actually what gives moeen the advantage. He's so inconsistent in getting it to land on the seam that it gives him natural variation. If he can learn to vary his pace like tredwell does he can become much better.
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grecian
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
The revs Moeen puts on the ball is massively more than Tredders. Hence why he can exploit any wear in the pitch.
morgieb
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Not sure what the English selectors see in Jordan. He doesn't have an eye-popping trait that makes him desirable in a way a Plunkett does, and his stats look pretty poor if you take out the Test he played at The Oval (where India had already given up).
Even picking Stokes if you have Moeen and other bowlers who can bat seems redundant.
Even picking Stokes if you have Moeen and other bowlers who can bat seems redundant.
Scaly piscine
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
He has plus points but Jordan has never looked like a Test bowler. Manages to bowl at around 90mph but be completely innocuous. I've no idea how he managed to move ahead of Stokes and Plunkett in the pecking order. Or a few others for that matter.
Stapel
International Regular
Is there any chance England consider Mark Wood? I'm not saying they should, as I know nothing about him. But it's interesting to a newcomer in the squad.
Scaly piscine
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Bowls around the same pace, but skids on (only about 6 foot tall) and just a far better bowler all-round.
Oh yes, I agree with that. Gets really good drift with those revs too. I dunno though, it's not just the revs. An attacking spinner needs to really know how to work a batsman over. If all you need are revs lyon would have been been much better at running through sides in fourth innings long ago.
flibbertyjibber
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No Taylor, huge blow for WI