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*Official* New Zealand in England 2015

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
We should do better this time round, but can't ever underestimate the Broad & Anderson combo at home. Really all hinges on Southee hitting form again and our openers getting the scorecard past 50 without losing a wicket.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Where we've strengthened since that tour:
A settled (and pretty awesome) 3-5
A match-winning-ish spinner. Liked Bucko but he contributed naught in the last tour and Bracewell played the second game
The Boult + Southee combo has matured since that tour
We have 1 decent opener who seems to like overseas challenge
Watling has become a beast
+ Henry in the squad

Where we've weakened:
No Brownlie; he did alright over there and I personally have ??? over CJ in Tests
Still got Rutherford...though he has shown glimpses of improving

Remains to be seen:
An A-R at six(remember we had Baz & Guptill here last time) - that is assuming we play Corey J. This could be a bonus in the bowling stakes as I think we relied on Kane as the 5th option.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
I can see 2 types of XIs playing

The first, and would be my choice, an incumbentish-like-for-like XI.

1. Latham
2. Rutherford
3. Williamson
4. Taylor
5. McCullum
6. Anderson
7. Watling+
8. Craig
9. Bracewell
10. Southee
11. Boult

Gups may usurp Rutherford; I have a feeling Rudds will play though.

Second would be some scenario where they don't think the pitch will spin so they'll leave out Craig and by extension Corey J because you don't need 5 seamers

1. Latham
2. Rutherford
3. Williamson
4. Taylor
5. McCullum
6. Guptill
7. Watling+
8. Bracewell
9. Wagner/Henry
10. Southee
11. Boult

Burn the second with lots of fire, even if it means we'd see Henry ***ing up the field.
 
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theegyptian

International Vice-Captain
Injuries are going to be of importance going into this series. I'd be surprised if both Boult and Southee play both tests given their recent and current workload. England could also suffer some injuries in the Windies.
 

Hurricane

Hall of Fame Member
Where we've strengthened since that tour:
A settled (and pretty awesome) 3-5
A match-winning-ish spinner. Liked Bucko but he contributed naught in the last tour and Bracewell played the second game
The Boult + Southee combo has matured since that tour
We have 1 decent opener who seems to like overseas challenge
Watling has become a beast
+ Henry in the squad

Where we've weakened:
No Brownlie; he did alright over there and I personally have ??? over CJ in Tests
Still got Rutherford...though he has shown glimpses of improving

Remains to be seen:
An A-R at six(remember we had Baz & Guptill here last time) - that is assuming we play Corey J. This could be a bonus in the bowling stakes as I think we relied on Kane as the 5th option.
DWTA - sort of

I think Kane and Ross were playing well back then. Brendon has probably improved and so has Watling. But Latham is an unknown quantity in English conditions.

Tim and Boult were already beasts by that stage. They became beasts in Sri Lanka in Nov 2012 and have never looked back. Don't expect them to do any better than what they did last time. I think Tim got a match 10fer anyway last time.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
DWTA - sort of

I think Kane and Ross were playing well back then. Brendon has probably improved and so has Watling. But Latham is an unknown quantity in English conditions.

Tim and Boult were already beasts by that stage. They became beasts in Sri Lanka in Nov 2012 and have never looked back. Don't expect them to do any better than what they did last time. I think Tim got a match 10fer anyway last time.
IIRC both Tim and Boult went missing in an innings. Which is okay - you're suppose to have 2-3 others to step up if that's the case - but I'd expect them now, having both bowled in those conditions and just generally more experience, to gun it further.

And even if Latham is an unknown quantity in those conditions, I can't see him having a tour worse than Fulton or Rutherford, though I guess Rutherford actually now with experience in those conditions theoretically should be better.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Injuries are going to be of importance going into this series. I'd be surprised if both Boult and Southee play both tests given their recent and current workload. England could also suffer some injuries in the Windies.
Yeah I'm hoping for a full strength match up, but who knows what that is with England these days :ph34r: I mean, obviously things depend on players form post-WIndies but what would be the ideal fully-fit English XI for this series?
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Batting Guptill at six would be insane IMO. Even if he wasn't going to bowl at all, Anderson's definitely a better batsman than Rutherford.. and realistically, Guptill himself.
 

Hurricane

Hall of Fame Member
IIRC both Tim and Boult went missing in an innings. Which is okay - you're suppose to have 2-3 others to step up if that's the case - but I'd expect them now, having both bowled in those conditions and just generally more experience, to gun it further.

And even if Latham is an unknown quantity in those conditions, I can't see him having a tour worse than Fulton or Rutherford, though I guess Rutherford actually now with experience in those conditions theoretically should be better.
Latham is loose outside off stump when it is short of a length. He likes to have a fiddle. Got out on test debut that way. He is not a sure thing. He is the real deal, but may be a work in progress for a few more tours. He in particular would benefit from some time in county cricket.
 

Kippax

Cricketer Of The Year
The grip Latham uses for a bit of a power cheat (twisting both wrists outwards) seemed ill-suited for the conditions on the tour last year tbh. Cutting across the full and swinging ball a lot, and punching his forward defence into place with the bottom hand.

 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Batting Guptill at six would be insane IMO. Even if he wasn't going to bowl at all, Anderson's definitely a better batsman than Rutherford.. and realistically, Guptill himself.
Agreed. It was a comment on his Test selection that has had me nervous, in that he can apparently cover several batting positions...
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Latham is loose outside off stump when it is short of a length. He likes to have a fiddle. Got out on test debut that way. He is not a sure thing. He is the real deal, but may be a work in progress for a few more tours. He in particular would benefit from some time in county cricket.
This is true. But given his limited successes so far I feel far more confident in his abilities than I did in Fulton & Rutherford the last tour.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
IIRC both Tim and Boult went missing in an innings. Which is okay - you're suppose to have 2-3 others to step up if that's the case - but I'd expect them now, having both bowled in those conditions and just generally more experience, to gun it further.

And even if Latham is an unknown quantity in those conditions, I can't see him having a tour worse than Fulton or Rutherford, though I guess Rutherford actually now with experience in those conditions theoretically should be better.
Southee and Boult both went missing in the first innings of the Basin Reserve test v Sri Lanka this year. They also went missing in the first innings of the 3rd test v WI last June (when Wagner had to bail them out). As good as they are, they're not infallible, and I don't think they've improved much - if at all- in the last couple of years. Boult maybe in the last 6 months, but in the same period Southee has (if anything) gone backwrds. That's not a slight on them, they're both wonderful bowlers - but that was already the case on NZ's last England tour.

The area where NZ has improved is the top order batting. Flawed as Latham may be he's a definite step up over Peter Fulton. And 2015 KW is a significantly better batsman than 2013 KW. I think more than any other one player, Williamson will determine how NZ go in this series. If he can extend his form from the last 18 months into the tour of England, then NZ will score the runs that we need to give our bowlers a chance. Otherwise I suspect England will run away with things.
 

hendrix

Hall of Fame Member
It's hard to see where top order runs from either team will come from, tbh.

It's a near impossible ask for the openers. I'll be surprised if any of them average more than 20.
 

straw man

Hall of Fame Member
England would surely benefit from a couple of months of nothing-but County Cricket to get over their recent upsets, get back to normality, forget the World Cup and give time for some good domestic players to put up performances and force their way into the England side. Instead they're touring the Windies, then playing us in conditions that should suit our seamers and then the Ashes; there's no let-up. I don't envy them. I also have little feel for how their current tour of WI will turn out and whether it will result in a boost in confidence for them or not. All that said, anyone that thinks NZ are favourites for this series is dreaming imo, purely because England's new ball attack in late May is still every chance of tearing through our batting four innings from four, just like last time. We are definitely a better chance than last time though and I personally would be disappointed with any less than winning one test.

I assume we're going to get 200 v 200 shootouts with the Duke hooping round corners - noone expects anything else right? I have no concerns about our bowling; even if Southee or Boult have a bad day we should still have Henry or Bracewell (probably the latter due to incumbency I imagine) who will suit the conditions.... as long as Durg doesn't bowl short rubbish. However in low scoring matches it's all about which sides' batsmen can perform.

I'm disappointed for Brownlie, pleased for Guptill and still perplexed at the gargantuan faith shown in Rutherford. That said, none of those three nor Latham is a good bet for runs in this series - it will be very tough for openers. I'd be ecstatic with two fifties from our openers' eight innings and wouldn't be surprised if there are zero. I just hope Brownlie's omission isn't because the selectors have found something they don't like and will leave him out of further consideration too.

Like Bahnz said Williamson stemming the flow of wickets at three will be vital - he's scored difficult runs there for Yorkshire, some of them quite ugly I believe, and his crease occupation is huge for us. The bowling is going to push defensive techniques to the limit and Williamson has the best defense of anyone in the side. Some of the rest are fairly shaky. If I remember right Taylor was our only batsman averaging over 30 last tour - we need at least that from him again too.

I also think McCullum batting aggressively at five could be a sneaky trump card - hit bowlers off their length and ride your luck for a quick 70 here or there; would be huge in a low-scoring match. Aside from that, I'd like to see some lower-order runs if, as is quite likely, the top 6 is bundled out just in time for the ball to stop swinging (as appreciably). Watling/Craig/Bracewell at 7-9 is very handy.
 
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NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Southee and Boult both went missing in the first innings of the Basin Reserve test v Sri Lanka this year. They also went missing in the first innings of the 3rd test v WI last June (when Wagner had to bail them out). As good as they are, they're not infallible, and I don't think they've improved much - if at all- in the last couple of years. Boult maybe in the last 6 months, but in the same period Southee has (if anything) gone backwrds. That's not a slight on them, they're both wonderful bowlers - but that was already the case on NZ's last England tour.
Oh no doubt, but given the overall state of the teams at the time (iirc a recent post-Taylor-captaincy-saga-situation and coming off a demoralising RSA tour) I think how Southee + Boult are bowling now speak more as a duo than they did then. The winning culture of the team, and all that, is the improvement I'm speaking on. And simply more experience away from home, like the UAE and WIndies tours. Remember that Southee & Boult didn't regularly start opening the bowling together until that Sri Lanka away tour, which was followed by England home then away. Even if they were already wonderful bowlers at that point, I'm saying simply because of experience and performance they're now a great opening duo whereas at that time you would've called their opening bowling partnership 'good yet unproven' as it was their 3rd series opening the bowling together.

The area where NZ has improved is the top order batting. Flawed as Latham may be he's a definite step up over Peter Fulton. And 2015 KW is a significantly better batsman than 2013 KW. I think more than any other one player, Williamson will determine how NZ go in this series. If he can extend his form from the last 18 months into the tour of England, then NZ will score the runs that we need to give our bowlers a chance. Otherwise I suspect England will run away with things.
Oh indeed. I think McCullum himself being cemented at five is also a cornerstone to that. He went missing in that series and at that time was floating around 5/6 with Brownlie (kept in the 2nd game and batted 7th). Taylor was in a world beating phase and the only one to score more than one 50. You'd say Taylor's regressed a bit, kinda like Southee, but McCullum and Williamson have improved out of sight, and Latham's a definite step up. Having a fully fit Watling will be huge. The key figures for our batting, as you've surmised already, will be mostly Williamson but also Watling, and one of Taylor or McCullum will need to fire. Given Baz's mood of late I'd say it'll be him - especially after the ODI walloping we gave them.
 

Kippax

Cricketer Of The Year

Boult will be looking to pose a much slicker and more cold-blooded threat than the wide-eyed 80mph boy in that video did, you'd say.
 
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