***Official*** New Zealand in the West Indies 2014

[RxGM]

Im surprised to see that Williamson is playing this round of county games. I know the precedint has been set by the IPL guys but Kane should be arriving for the tour at the same time as everyone else. Part of being a team is that you do things together - he will miss the first warm up game

Match start delayed (Start delayed due to rain) | Live Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo

A song a dance wont be made about this by the NZ media because it is FC cricket and the money isn't huge but imo it is on par with Taylor/Vettori/McCullum cashing in rather than playing tour matches in England as part of the team

 

[Howsie]

At the end of the day the West Indies don't have a bowler in the same class as either Boult or Southee, period. Regardless of the pitch they have both proven over the last two years they can get it done anywhere. They fire New Zealand win.

 

[hendrix]

Didn't Bolt play in the Bang series? and from what i can tell he didn't do too well out there...
.

Boult was by far the best pace bowler on show in Bangladesh. He started out well, but grew less effective as the games wore on as he had virtually no support - Bracewell was utterly rubbish, as were Bruce Martin and Sodhi. That pace attack was a one man show without Southee, and Wagner not playing the first test.

 

[Hurricane]

Boult was by far the best pace bowler on show in Bangladesh. He started out well, but grew less effective as the games wore on as he had virtually no support - Bracewell was utterly rubbish, as were Bruce Martin and Sodhi. That pace attack was a one man show without Southee, and Wagner not playing the first test.

also due to the heat he only bowled 3-4 over spells.

 

[hendrix]

also due to the heat he only bowled 3-4 over spells.

depending on your POV and the game situation, one of the good things about McCullum's captaincy is that he makes sure that Southee and Boult aren't over-bowled.

Jarrod Kimber wrote a nice piece about it.

Of course, I don't completely agree with it, because even with the old ball, Southee and Boult are still easily our best bowlers - and particularly at that time. Although with Wagner growing another arm and leg in the Indian series and hopefully the development of the slow bowlers, there'll be no need to ride them into the ground.

 

[Kippax]

Im surprised to see that Williamson is playing this round of county games. I know the precedint has been set by the IPL guys but Kane should be arriving for the tour at the same time as everyone else. Part of being a team is that you do things together - he will miss the first warm up game

Match start delayed (Start delayed due to rain) | Live Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo

A song a dance wont be made about this by the NZ media because it is FC cricket and the money isn't huge but imo it is on par with Taylor/Vettori/McCullum cashing in rather than playing tour matches in England as part of the team

Not sure Hesson rates the farcical lack of intensity in two-day warmups at all, itbt. He appeared pretty easy about Fulton and Rutherford putting Edgar in his place about that.

 

[Kippax]

Has JimmyGS been released, with Delhi shunting it?

Edit: no, playing a game as we speak.

 

[Kippax]

Cribbage favourite Tim Johnston should've bought himself an airfare. Would've genuinely got a game for New Zealand on a Jamaican pitch.

 

[Kippax]

 

[Kippax]

Haven't seen any Sky NZ promos for this tour.

Just saw one ftr.

Stand by for WW's Roach request...

 

[Kippax]

 

[Kippax]

 

[WindieWeathers]

At the end of the day the West Indies don't have a bowler in the same class as either Boult or Southee, period. Regardless of the pitch they have both proven over the last two years they can get it done anywhere. They fire New Zealand win.

Well for a start Roach says HELLO...secondly what have those two won NZ away from home? aside from one test in SL i don't see much. Narine, Roach, Shilly and Taylor/Holder are more dangerous as a unit than anything that NZ will muster up on this tour in my opinion.

Boult and Southee done very well in NZ..but they were no more devastating than Roach and Narine were when we won in the Caribbean...and soon enough one of them won't fire and what then? If Roach doesn't fire we'll have Narine and Shilly..if Taylor doesn't fire we'll have Roach and Narine..We'll see how the kiwis deal with that.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Thanks for the videos Kippax

 

[Flem274*]

I rate roach higher than most on this forum but you're delusional to not be afraid of southee and boult away from home. They're not the reason NZ have lost away games - the batsmen are.

You have a near world class bowler returning from a long injury layoff, a spinner who relies on big turn and unreadability, a reformed thrower who was previously excellent but is untried with his new action and finally a choice between a raw talent and a quality but perpetual crock who last played a test when dinosaurs walked the earth. NZ have a huge gaping hole in the spin department but you're forgetting the vital contributions of Wagner and Anderson to test wins - they are who will stand up if southee and boult fail. Southee has a better away than home record btw.

you're an idiot to be counting your chickens. If you win I suspect it will be down to the diffence in spin bowling between the two sides but your posting is, as usual, comical at best.

Where's beamer btw peeps? He's always good value for learning about windows cricket.

 

[WindieWeathers]

I rate roach higher than most on this forum but you're delusional to not be afraid of southee and boult away from home. They're not the reason NZ have lost away games - the batsmen are.

You have a near world class bowler returning from a long injury layoff, a spinner who relies on big turn and unreadability, a reformed thrower who was previously excellent but is untried with his new action and finally a choice between a raw talent and a quality but perpetual crock who last played a test when dinosaurs walked the earth. NZ have a huge gaping hole in the spin department but you're forgetting the vital contributions of Wagner and Anderson to test wins - they are who will stand up if southee and boult fail. Southee has a better away than home record btw.

you're an idiot to be counting your chickens. If you win I suspect it will be down to the diffence in spin bowling between the two sides but your posting is, as usual, comical at best.

Where's beamer btw peeps? He's always good value for learning about windows cricket.

Be bigger than that please..i've grown up since my past transgressions and i hope you've grown since then too. Anyway i don't believe my comments were anymore contraversial than the quote i was responding to....but let me digress that for a second and address your claims.

Narine= Whatever you think he "relies" on is neither here nore there Flem...his RECORD against NZ is there for all to see.

Shilly= I think the "new bowling action" stuff is overplayed...yes he's tweaked his style a little but then came back and got a 10fer in his first game for Winwards...believe me having seen him he's still causing massive problems.

Taylor= Yes he's come back after a few years out of the game but he's proven his fitness by playing a whole season for Jamaica in both one dayers and four day games..and took wickets...the pace got better the more games he played and he was swinging the ball both ways as usual...i'm confident if picked he'll do himself justice...remember he's still only 29 years old.

Holder= proved his quality against NZ in the ODI's already...and tbh i don't think Williamson will fancy facing him again

But you know what Flem? the attack i talked of might not even be the one picked..Gabriel might just play having vastly improved during our four day competition with Trinidad..while Benn might come back in having fought hard to regain his place.

In closing Boult and Southee are VERY GOOD bowlers who have done NZ proud over the past few years...if they fire in the caribbean then that will no doubt prove they have the ability to shine in all types of conditions... my notion still remains the same though...as a unit we're gonna have the better attack...does that mean we're certain to win? no because the batting will have to stand up aswell...but it does give us a good chance.

 

[hendrix]

I don't want to chase WW out of this thread because then it becomes a circle jerk.

Boult and Southee done very well in NZ..but they were no more devastating than Roach and Narine were when we won in the Caribbean...and soon enough one of them won't fire and what then? If Roach doesn't fire we'll have Narine and Shilly..if Taylor doesn't fire we'll have Roach and Narine..We'll see how the kiwis deal with that.

Yes, I agree with that. The problem is that that was 2 years ago - Roach has barely played competitive cricket in the past 6 months and NZ have actually improved dramatically in all departments.

1. Is the obvious one, the Southee Boult combo who have been impressive in India, Sri Lanka, England and NZ. Most of those wickets were very flat.

2. The stability and development of the batting line up. While I'm not a fan of Williamson at 3, he has been very good, Taylor has superb, and McCullum has played some ATG innings. Then there's Watling and a tail that actually hangs around.

3. The wicket-keeping and slip catching has improved drastically since Watling has taken over the gloves. This is pretty significant. You would have seen some of the catches the team took in NZ - really outstanding stuff and it just lifts the bowlers.

On the other hand, the Windies have regressed. Bravo, Narine and Ramdin are bright spots for sure, but we haven't seen much from anyone else. They could lift their team, Roach and Taylor could come back and be excellent, Gayle could have a nice swansong, Chanderpaul could keep doing what he does...but based on what we've seen from the last 2 years, it's unlikely.

 

[hendrix]

I will say that the way Roach bowled to Williamson was what made me have some real doubts about Williamson's ability to play top quality pace bowling, so kudos to him. I wonder whether Williamson has improved since then and whether Roach can muster that some excellence.

 

[WindieWeathers]

It's all about opinions Hendrix and my history of having passionate debates with you guys goes way back...and long may it continue ..

Anyway a few things if i may.

1. We won six tests in a row before we went to India under-cooked...then we went to NZ with a lot of key players missing..especially from our attack...therefore i think it's harsh to suggest we've "regressed" tbh.

2. You mentioned the series in India and SL and yes there was some good bowling...but the batting on a number of occasions totally collapsed against spin...and i'm not sure the NZ top order has improved in that department that much considering Narine's 6fer and also Shilly's 4fer in the first test of the series in NZ.

3. Also another point about the batting...Williamson, Taylor, Mccullum are good..while Watling has played a few decent innings...who else is there? especially in the opening slots? Imo what actually won NZ the series against us was our attacks totally lack of ability to remove Taylor early...take away his individual contributions and it would have been a lot closer...i'd be very surprised indeed if our strongest attack allowed that to happen in the Caribbean.

4. We also have to look at what happened the last time NZ played in conditions similar to the Caribbean...which was the tour in Bang...guys like Gazi got a 6fer.....

Anyway it's all great debate and i'm just looking forward to the action getting started.

 

[hendrix]

a couple of things:

2. I refuse to acknowledge Shillingford's efforts as he was proven to be chucking. Both his offspinner and his doosra were proven well beyond the legal limits. That's what, the third time now? I'm sorry but he needs to go play baseball.

3. Yes I agree, the inability to remove Taylor early was key. And do you think that will be any easier on flatter pitches with less in it for the seamers? You can't seriously be expecting Narine to do it all by himself, especially since Taylor still managed to score a century against him in spinning conditions.

4. Wickets in two drawn tests don't really mean much, I'm afraid. Yes, he bowled well but NZ still scored easily enough runs to be on top in that series.