*Official* Fifth Test at the SCG

[Tangles]

A debut for a young leggie with us going for 5 nil with Warner, Watson, Clarke, Smith, George and Rad in the line up sounds a great idea. For Australia and the Sydney crowd. Pity the kid though.

 

[BoyBrumby]

It isn't the way I'd go, but really, Plan A hasn't come off has it? What's to be lost? It's looking like 5-0 regardless of how we shuffle the deckchairs & we might just learn something about Borthwick's character.

Finn seems more of a desperate shout to my way of thinking; every report I've read suggests his performance in the nets is that of a work in regress. For all the talk of Tremmers having lost his pace, only Broad has taken his wickets more cheaply for us.

 

[Tangles]

He will be targeted and hit out of the attack. Then Cook won't want to bowl him at all. Waste of a spot. Your better off with Monty or Ballance if Cook won't bowl a spinner not named Swann.

Your willing to risk another Kerrigan ?

 

[BoyBrumby]

He will be targeted and hit out of the attack. Then Cook won't want to bowl him at all. Waste of a spot. Your better off with Monty or Ballance if Cook won't bowl a spinner not named Swann.

Your willing to risk another Kerrigan ?

TBF Kerrigan is a much better bowler than Borthwick at first class level. He froze completely on his test debut. Really his figures (what were they 0/53 from 8?) flattered him, so poor was he.

Borthwick might be able to make the leap Kerrigan wasn't. As I said, it isn't the way I'd go (Ballance for Carberry with Bell moving up to open is the only change I'd make, ftr) but it's not as if anything is to be lost. If Borthwick can't step up (and I doubt he can) he's unlikely to be a serious option for tests anyway.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

TBF Kerrigan is a much better bowler than Borthwick at first class level. He froze completely on his test debut. Really his figures (what were they 0/53 from 8?) flattered him, so poor was he.

Borthwick might be able to make the leap Kerrigan wasn't. As I said, it isn't the way I'd go (Ballance for Carberry with Bell moving up to open is the only change I'd make, ftr) but it's not as if anything is to be lost. If Borthwick can't step up (and I doubt he can) he's unlikely to be a serious option for tests anyway.

Sums it up fairly well. if they are going to try Borthwick may as well do it in a dead rubber now and find out rather than waiting and finding out later he isn't up to it. At least Borthwick can allegedly bat so helps us a bit, not sure where in the order he should go though.

 

[Pothas]

Think it is a dreadful idea personally, this tour has been awful for everyone, no need to taint any other players with it. Let's just get this **** over and done with the players we have used so far and then we can look at everything again in a few months time.

 

[grecian]

Borthwick is a different case to Kerrigan though as FJ said, in that he can fall back on another skill if he gets clogged when under pressure (something he has previous with BTW).

Having said that it would be pure stupidity to not play Monty at Sydney, in the same way it was in not playing Finn, Tremmers or Rankin at Perth. So I'm guessing that's what we'll do.

 

[Red]

Bailey seems like he's good around the team environment, positive guy and all that. Not quite test standard, and he's always going to be at his best when he's given full license to attack- chasing quick runs.

Most of the spots for the first test v South Africa are probably locked now apart from #6.

 

[Adders]

A win at the SCG will keep Eng above Australia in the rankings.

 

[Mark68]

How about flying Reece Topley and Tymal Mills in? Is James Taylor in Australia? Throw them all in. The rebuilding starts here.

 

[Adders]

How about flying Reece Topley and Tymal Mills in? Is James Taylor in Australia? Throw them all in. The rebuilding starts here.

We're renovating mate, not building a new house!!

Someone else mentioned this in one of the threads but there is no point throwing young inexperienced players to the wolves in this last test, Now would be the worst possible time for a player to debut, team moral would be **** and they are up against a rampant Aussie side out for blood............lets limit the mental damage to those already on tour

The rebuilding can start once this train wreck of a tour is over.

 

[BoyBrumby]

BBC reporting Monty's struggling with a calf injury, so it looks as if the selectors' hands may be forced.

Or, if one were cynically minded, it must just be a convenient smokescreen for a Hail Mary.

 

[Adders]

BBC reporting Monty's struggling with a calf injury, so it looks as if the selectors' hands may be forced.

Or, if one were cynically minded, it must just be a convenient smokescreen for a Hail Mary.

LOL, that's exactly what I thought when I saw that news.

I dunno, playing Borthwick in this environment just seems crazy to me. We've probably wrecked one potential future spinner in Kerrigan, why throw another to the wolves? It's one thing to throw a child into the deep end and see if they swim but quite another to drop them off in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.

 

[uvelocity]

pacific is by far the superior ocean

 

[Mark68]

It makes me wonder if all is really well on the county cricket production line. Is it still the right environment to produce mentally strong and tough Test cricketers? Or at least those capable of achieving that. There is still far too much cricket played and not enough emphasis on honing and practising key skills.

Or perhaps that is a debate for another day..

 

[wpdavid]

LOL, that's exactly what I thought when I saw that news.

I dunno, playing Borthwick in this environment just seems crazy to me. We've probably wrecked one potential future spinner in Kerrigan, why throw another to the wolves? It's one thing to throw a child into the deep end and see if they swim but quite another to drop them off in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.

Dunno about the Kerrigan comparison. If he couldn't cope with a dead rubber at the fag end of a 3-0 win, and that at a ground that has generally helped spinners, then there's probably no hope for the boy. This is rather a different scenario for young Borthwick, but I'd still rather see him than Trundlewell. If he goes for loads, so be it. We'll learn something about his character anyway.

 

[Dan]

It makes me wonder if all is really well on the county cricket production line. Is it still the right environment to produce mentally strong and tough Test cricketers? Or at least those capable of achieving that. There is still far too much cricket played and not enough emphasis on honing and practising key skills.

Or perhaps that is a debate for another day..

England beat Australia: "oh County Cricket is great because young players play regularly and can learn/develop their games; the Sheffield Shield isn't long enough/doesn't have enough teams and the players break down from not having worked hard; 16 games a season is 6 games better than 10 a season"

Australia beat England: "oh the County Cricket system is broken because young players play too much and get into bad habits and get injured from overwork and 18 teams mean the player quality is diluted; the Sheffield Shield gets the balance right by only having 6"

 

[wpdavid]

It makes me wonder if all is really well on the county cricket production line. Is it still the right environment to produce mentally strong and tough Test cricketers? Or at least those capable of achieving that. There is still far too much cricket played and not enough emphasis on honing and practising key skills.

Or perhaps that is a debate for another day..

Probably is. But my view is that we've been heading down the slippery slope ever since we doubled the number of 2020 group games.

 

[Burgey]

Or it might be that this immediate past crop of players was an aberration and County Cricket is still as poor a system for producing test players as it was from the late 80s to the early 2000s.

There's a pleasant thought. Happy New Year.

 

[wpdavid]

Or it might be that this immediate past crop of players was an aberration and County Cricket is still as poor a system for producing test players as it was from the late 80s to the early 2000s.

There's a pleasant thought. Happy New Year.

And to you too.

I'll leave the first bit for another thread.