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***Official*** India in Australia 2011/12

Scaly piscine

Scaly piscine

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Subhadeep said:
I just checked Graham Onions' stats. He has played but 8 tests and taken 30 wickets, it seems. Holy ****! The English cricket fans are really something! The guy does not have much more credentials than Umesh Yadav.
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Your line of argument seems to be that Mohammed Sami is a better bowler than Sylvester Clarke, because he played more Tests/took more Test wickets.

Onions is a class above Chris Martin, as are England's other second XI bowling options. They don't have to take 200+ Test wickets to prove it because it's obvious that they're good bowlers and Chris Martin isn't.

Anyway kinda hoping India make a game out of this just for a laugh, but that would probably involve Virat K**li doing well, so will have to settle for another drubbing and waking up to 3-0 tomorrow.
 
Jacknife

Jacknife

International Captain
Prince EWS said:
The point is that it's dangerous to say 517-1 ---> can't bowl.

You're taking the same dangerous over-confident attitude Australian fans had towards bowlers like Anderson before the last Ashes. Now Siddle and Hilfenhaus are not as good as Anderson no matter how much Son of Coco will probably disagree but Siddle was actually pretty good in the Ashes despite a lack of support and Hilfenhaus is bowling much better now.
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Tbh I never thought they were as bad as were being made out in the slightest, England just batted really well and made them look worse than they were.
 
NUFAN

NUFAN

Y no Afghanistan flag
Watto needs to come back pronto. Reckon the selectors are loathe to drop the vice captain from the team.
 
Burgey

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
NUFAN said:
Watto needs to come back pronto. Reckon the selectors are loathe to drop the vice captain from the team.
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God I hope we get to actually see Watto, three gun quicks and Lyon all fit in the one attack. Any of those playing this match, Cummins or Patto. Be so good.
 
Ruckus

Ruckus

International Captain
I really hope Watto doesn't need to play a big role as a bowler when he comes back though. Our batting still has the potential to be quite brittle, and we can't afford someone as talented with the bat as him to be out for 3 months or so everytime he picks up an injury. I quite like the idea of Watto at 3 though for Marsh, he has a pretty adaptable game which should work well in that position, and he also balances things out a bit better by being a right hand bat.
 
Sylvester

Sylvester

State Captain
Ruckus said:
I really hope Watto doesn't need to play a big role as a bowler when he comes back though. Our batting still has the potential to be quite brittle, and we can't afford someone as talented with the bat as him to be out for 3 months or so everytime he picks up an injury. I quite like the idea of Watto at 3 though for Marsh, he has a pretty adaptable game which should work well in that position, and he also balances things out a bit better by being a right hand bat.
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Clarke likes to use the 4th seamer so Watson will be getting quite a few overs as we have seen in the past. Pretty much replace Starc with Watson, Lyon with Hussey's overs from this innings and you have his template.
 
Burgey

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Ruckus said:
I really hope Watto doesn't need to play a big role as a bowler when he comes back though. Our batting still has the potential to be quite brittle, and we can't afford someone as talented with the bat as him to be out for 3 months or so everytime he picks up an injury. I quite like the idea of Watto at 3 though for Marsh, he has a pretty adaptable game which should work well in that position, and he also balances things out a bit better by being a right hand bat.
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Yeah that's a fair call, but having him there means you can always play a spinner and covers pretty much all contingencies.
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Scaly piscine said:
Your line of argument seems to be that Mohammed Sami is a better bowler than Sylvester Clarke, because he played more Tests/took more Test wickets.

Onions is a class above Chris Martin, as are England's other second XI bowling options. They don't have to take 200+ Test wickets to prove it because it's obvious that they're good bowlers and Chris Martin isn't.

Anyway kinda hoping India make a game out of this just for a laugh, but that would probably involve Virat K**li doing well, so will have to settle for another drubbing and waking up to 3-0 tomorrow.
Click to expand...
Martin brings a lot more value to his side though because a bowler who is always fully fit averaging 34 is more use than a Shane Bond type bowler when it comes to injuries who only averages 30.

Bond and Harris are so valuable despite injuries because they're so good. Onions has proven a decent bowler thus far, but he is so injury prone he isn't really worth the investment. If he were playing for a lesser test side he would be seen as a bonus when he's fit, rather than a saviour when he's fit like Bond was for NZ or Harris would be if Australia couldn't bowl.

Basically, if you're going to disregard fitness and test wickets in your assessment of players, Shane Bond is one of the greatest bowlers of all time, and Ryan Harris is fast getting there. I actually argued this as devils advocate once in a boring thread, but saying Onions bowls better than Martin overlooks the fact test cricketers need to be valuable as well as just highly skilled.
 
NUFAN

NUFAN

Y no Afghanistan flag
Yeah but Flem, Onions has been available but overlooked at times due to England's superior pace attack and the fact that they don't need to change the team. Onions would have more Test wickets if he was available for NZ.
 
Jarquis

Jarquis

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Flem274* said:
Martin brings a lot more value to his side though because a bowler who is always fully fit averaging 34 is more use than a Shane Bond type bowler when it comes to injuries who only averages 30.

Bond and Harris are so valuable despite injuries because they're so good. Onions has proven a decent bowler thus far, but he is so injury prone he isn't really worth the investment. If he were playing for a lesser test side he would be seen as a bonus when he's fit, rather than a saviour when he's fit like Bond was for NZ or Harris would be if Australia couldn't bowl.

Basically, if you're going to disregard fitness and test wickets in your assessment of players, Shane Bond is one of the greatest bowlers of all time, and Ryan Harris is fast getting there. I actually argued this as devils advocate once in a boring thread, but saying Onions bowls better than Martin overlooks the fact test cricketers need to be valuable as well as just highly skilled.
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Wouldn't say Onions is that injury prone tbh. Suffering a long term injury is entirely different to Bond/Harris/Watson/Ryder etc who seemingly suffer 8 week injuries at every given opportunity.
 
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