***Official*** India in Australia 2011/12

[benchmark00]

Watson probably won't be back at any point in this series, but there's no way in hell that he'll be left out when he is properly fit, and nor should he be. Australia's most valuable cricketer bar now who probably, on figures anyway, actually commands a place on both batting and bowling alone right now.

As for where he bats; personally I'd have him at 3.

There's no point to having him at 3 if you don't want him to open though. They're pretty similar.

Throw the **** in at 4 imo.

 

[Johnners]

In at 3 for Marsh.

 

[Prince EWS]

There's no point to having him at 3 if you don't want him to open though. They're pretty similar.

Throw the **** in at 4 imo.

I'm happy enough with him opening anyway tbh. I think him bowling more overs and him not batting as well has been more correlation than causation; especially since the stats people quote often include occasions where Australia batted first and he failed before going on to bowl 18 overs. He's not Nostradamus; It's part of the mindset of being an allrounder, where if you fail at one discipline you can make it up in the other.

I just think three is generally a better spot for him, whether he's bowling or not.

 

[silentstriker]

Greg Chappell tried to do something similar to what you are talking about. We all know how that ended.

Partly but there are different ways to do it - the main thing is that it can't come from the coach of the national team, and it can't be imposed by a foreigner (too much cultural resistance). It has to come from the selectors and BCCI.

SS, you've summed it up by saying it's a cultural change that needs to take place, but look at the Indian batting order and you'll see that the players playing were brought up in an era of Indian cricket where typically the fielding was poor etc.

Kohli is head and shoulders above everyone in the team in the field and running between wickets, however he's looking like he's not up to test match cricket with his main role at the moment.

That is true in some respects but you will notice how good fielders get fat and lazy and become complacent too. Raina, Rohit Sharma, etc...once they get the call up, their fitness falls by the wayside. Yes, a few players maintain it, but too many people are carried. And that doesn't even begin to address the defeatist attitude that seems to take hold.

I want to be done with this - so many times I don't go to sleep for a couple days on end so I can catch every ball of every Test match, and frankly, this is not deserving of my time or devotion.

 

[Ruckus]

Who do people think is the better batsmen out of Cowan and Marsh (FC performance in consideration too obv.)?

 

[Spikey]

Well Marsh is the better batsman. No doubt. But who is more likely to put up the results is much harder to say. I'd like to give them the series.

 

[Prince EWS]

Who do people think is the better batsmen out of Cowan and Marsh (FC performance in consideration too obv.)?

Tough. Marsh probably overall but it's close and doesn't necessarily mean he suits the needs of the team better.

His ton on debut holds more weight than anything Cowan has ever done though, really.

 

[Burgey]

I think Zaheer deserves more than Gambhir and Laxman.

rating Gambhir over Zaheer is definitely a case of Gambhiring

Z went AWOL Hilf-2010 Ashes style after his first spell tbf. And there were a lot of spells afterwards

Zaheer was awful, I mean awful day two, from the first over. At that point the match is still in the balance and he's trundled in like he hadn't warmed up and never got it over 125kph, let alone do the unthinkable and actually follow through. His first spell was Far below his capabilities and he only got worse really.

For me he was the biggest disappointment in the Indian attack, rather than either Yadav (rookie being asked to bowl to ridiculous fields) or Ashwin (visiting finger spinner in Australia - they haven't succeeded since Lance Gibbs ffs, or at least Derek Underwood). Sharma at least busted his arse and seemed to care.

 

[benchmark00]

I'm happy enough with him opening anyway tbh. I think him bowling more overs and him not batting as well has been more correlation than causation; especially since the stats people quote often include occasions where Australia batted first and he failed before going on to bowl 18 overs. He's not Nostradamus; It's part of the mindset of being an allrounder, where if you fail at one discipline you can make it up in the other.

I just think three is generally a better spot for him, whether he's bowling or not.

I don't care if he stays opening, but I'd prefer him at four.

Bowling and opening is mentally taxing. Perfect example:

Watson is bowling very well on day one. It's 30 minutes before stumps, the opposition is 9 down and Watson is bowling. All of a sudden his mind becomes a little bit conflicted, even if he wouldn't admit to it.

His role there is to take the wicket, but by doing that he has a ****ty little period to bat in. It results in either him not bowling well, or getting the wicket and then going in to open with a negative mind set.

At four it gives him a little bit of a breather. I think three is a nothing spot for a busy allrounder.

 

[Spikey]

His ton on debut holds more weight than anything Cowan has ever done though, really.

nah cowan shield final ton tbh


watson down to 6 for me whenever hussey leaves btw. unless he all of a sudden sorts out the 'can't get past 60' thing

 

[Burgey]

Who do people think is the better batsmen out of Cowan and Marsh (FC performance in consideration too obv.)?

Cowan. Just because Marsh plays a ***y cover drive doesn't excuse how ****tily lazy he is. It's like they wake him up to bat ffs.

Would back Cowan to contribute more consistently than him every day of the week. ****'s averaging three ffs. Cowan can at least say he was sawn off once or twice. Marsh has batted with an Indian-like attitude.

Drop the ****. He's he new Marcus North.

 

[Prince EWS]

Well Watson definitely shouldn't be any lower than four, because that'd mean moving Clarke up again, and FMD that would **** me. Anywhere in the top four is fine by me though.

 

[Spikey]

Well Watson definitely shouldn't be any lower than four, because that'd mean moving Clarke up again, and FMD that would **** me. Anywhere in the top four is fine by me though.

hence 'whenever hussey leaves btw.'

 

[benchmark00]

Well Watson definitely shouldn't be any lower than four, because that'd mean moving Clarke up again, and FMD that would **** me. Anywhere in the top four is fine by me though.

Yeah would obv agree with keeping Clarke at 5.

Just think there's no reason Ponting can't go back to 3.

 

[Burgey]

Yeah would obv agree with keeping Clarke at 5.

Just think there's no reason Ponting can't go back to 3.

But but but he averages well at four

 

[Prince EWS]

Yeah would obv agree with keeping Clarke at 5.

Just think there's no reason Ponting can't go back to 3.

Yeah I'd have no issue with Ponting at 3 and Watson and 4. Or Watson moving down to 6 when Hussey went. Any suggestions of moving Watson down to 6 now just bring far more problems than any they may solve though.

 

[Johnners]

Cowan. Just because Marsh plays a ***y cover drive doesn't excuse how ****tily lazy he is. It's like they wake him up to bat ffs.

Would back Cowan to contribute more consistently than him every day of the week. ****'s averaging three ffs. Cowan can at least say he was sawn off once or twice. Marsh has batted with an Indian-like attitude.

Drop the ****. He's he new Marcus North.

Called it first tbh

Marsh on course to become North 2.0?

 

[Burgey]

Called it first tbh

I'm with you Bro

 

[Spikey]

North performed very good in his second tour tbf

 

[Ruckus]

Cowan. Just because Marsh plays a ***y cover drive doesn't excuse how ****tily lazy he is. It's like they wake him up to bat ffs.

Would back Cowan to contribute more consistently than him every day of the week. ****'s averaging three ffs. Cowan can at least say he was sawn off once or twice. Marsh has batted with an Indian-like attitude.

Drop the ****. He's he new Marcus North.

Yeah, I think Cowan's grittiness and balanced pairing with Warner suits the teams needs better than Marsh atm. Think Marsh is definately the better batsman on his day though, but he is all potential...and probably little of it is ever going to be tapped.

If Watson is fit I'd put him at 3 instead of Marsh. I'd also hope he can finally prove his worth as a batsman alone, and Clarke will decreasingly see the need to utilise his bowling much.