Butt/Amir/Asif - Spot Fixing Trial

[Jono]

 

[Burgey]

Eh.

It can be complex, playing the victim.

 

[Burgey]

Gold.

 

[Burgey]

Tell me an 18 year old who thinks beforehand.

Usually have a think about where they leave the bong tbf.

 

[TheChevyBomb]

It can be complex, playing the victim.

yeah can be but the team still has people like malik and akmals so they are use to it,, wont have any problems lol

 

[TT Boy]

The poor boy Ameer arguments don't wash on any level. If he's not playing then someone else is. For all the things he misses out on someone else gets a shot. I prefer to think of the person who's missing out because that cheat is playing.

Every game before and after Ameer plays in will be sullied and the game of cricket itself is damaged. This goes way beyond one individual. If you look at the bigger picture there's only one punishment you can have - a life ban. The thought of Ameer playing again for Pakistan is just ghastly for the game, it will bring the spot fixing affair back into the spotlight. The focus will not be on the field of play. You can't underestimate the damage it will do. Personally I don't watch snooker any more since John Higgins agreed to lose some frames for a quarter of a million (he was let off with a pathetic 6 month ban in a whitewash, didn't miss any major tournaments).

Indeed, it doesn't at all. Amir was involved in Pak representative sides from the age of 13, surely when he is playing for Pak U19 (at the age of 14 according to listed age) or what have you, the players are taught and brought up to speed on what’s cricket and what isn’t? He wasn't same kid who was called up from the village and chucked into the national side. Kid was talked for years about being the next big thing in Pak cricket and toured here, there and everywhere (including England) playing for Pak U19. If he wasn't for a stress fracture of the back he would have played in 2 U19 World Cups before the age of 17.

Though conversely when Pak employ coaches like Ijaz Ahmed as their U19 coach and national batting coach, what do you expect? Ijaz was probably worse than his brother in-law Saleem Malik as Ijaz according to Ata-ur-Rehman and Intikhab Alam was still capable of fixing games he didn’t even play in.

 

[Athlai]

I agree that you can't just let him off because he was a dumb kid, but I still think it is slightly overblown to hand out life-time bans for spot fixing. 5 years is fine for the dumb ****. It's hardly like other cricketers will remember how "easily" he got off when he lost a significant portion of his career to all this, as well as the stigma of being a cheat for the rest of his life.

 

[smash84]

I wish more people would come out with this sort of honesty tbh

If someone else did it ,they would get shot down as ridiculous,nonsense,biased,immoral with several posts full of expletives tbh.

 

[joker4life]

I don't care about Butt and Asif but i think Aamir should get second chance.. simply because he is young and we all make mistake at that age..

as much as I would love to see Asif bowle.. I want him bann for life.. He was the best bowler i have watched bowling after Glen McGrath..so much talent..

 

[Spikey]

swear to god it's like all the indian fans have seen the pakistani fans want amir and asif out forever and so have gone the other way and want them back asap

 

[smash84]

agree regarding Asif's bowling. It was just too good watching him toy around with batsman. The turd

 

[smash84]

swear to god it's like all the indian fans have seen the pakistani fans want amir and asif out forever and so have gone the other way and want them back asap

 

[Daemon]

Just by-the-by, I still see no mention of this on cricinfo or the Beeb.

Would've thought this was pretty huge news in the cricket world so this surprises me more than a little.

They're all waiting for the conclusion of this thread so they can use the ideas and write an article obviously

 

[fredfertang]

Story is a stalking horse

 

[morgieb]

Tell me an 18 year old who thinks beforehand.

Most 18 year old's wouldn't match-fix. That's just plain disregard to your team, and there should be bans if you even bet on your own match, let alone fix it so you get an automatic.

 

[morgieb]

Actually think Asif got the rough end of the stick. There's no evidence his spot-fixing was as bad as Amir's, and his ban's pretty much life given he'll be 33 when he comes back. Although, it wasn't his first discretion, so....

 

[morgieb]

I agree that you can't just let him off because he was a dumb kid, but I still think it is slightly overblown to hand out life-time bans for spot fixing. 5 years is fine for the dumb ****. It's hardly like other cricketers will remember how "easily" he got off when he lost a significant portion of his career to all this, as well as the stigma of being a cheat for the rest of his life.

Fair point.

 

[morgieb]

What about shane warne mark waugh, and the south african trio who were only banned for a year or six months only,,, why them for 5 years,, the law should be equal for everyone,, fair enough warne was banned for a year for dopping,, but he was also involved with a bookie along with waugh,, they were never banned let alone being fined,, no one made an example out of wasim akram, waqar younis mushtaq ahmed and the gang when they were involved in MATCH FIXING not spot fixing,, they were all fined with ridiculous amounts of money,,, small fines thats it,, why him now,, IPL had been involved in match fixing it has been proved but everythings been hushed hushed,, why because BCCI runs it,,, thats just double standards,, if other people were given a second chance then he should be no exception

fmd.

Those involved in match-fixing were given life bans. The "John the Bookie" incident was different - was there any evidence that they actually threw matches, or was it just giving bookies 'information' about the match? They did get fined after all. Also, the ****'s would've gotten longer bans had they been able to prove they were match fixing.

 

[morgieb]

Sorry for the confusion, due to a typo my post said "taking crap" when I meant "talking crap".

Yes this was a serious case, but a life ban is an extreme sanction which in my view would have been disproportionately harsh.

The fact that the guy was 18 was relevant in two fairly obvious ways.

First, youth is a mitigating factor. No-one aged 18 has the same level of judgment, or resilience to persuasion or other forms of pressure, that they do when somewhat more mature.

And second, a life ban is a much longer sentence for an 18 year old than for someone in, say, his mid to late 20s. If Amir and Asif had both been banned for life, Asif's ban would effectively have been for about seven years longer and he'd have lost perhaps 90% of his Test career compared with perhaps 50% for Asif. So, the very young guy with a clean prior record ends up with a tougher sentence than the older repeat offender. Thats hardly fair, surely?

Err...in this case they both got the same sentence.

I understand wrt what yer talking about if he got a life ban, but Amir's more likely to come back and have a substantial test career instead of Asif.

 

[Hurricane]

Don't really care about the length of his ban finer minds than I can debate that. But just want to say that I disagree with this logic that his confession should cause a reassessment of his ban. He had his day in court with the ICC and chose not to confess that was his chance. Confessing much later in England is irrelevant.