***Official*** Australia in Sri Lanka

[Spark]

He's not in the ODI squad...?

 

[Spikey]

Yeah he is. Not in the T20's though. Source: Australia One-Day Squad | Australia in Sri Lanka ODI Series, 2011 | Cricket Squads | ESPN Cricinfo / http://www.espncricinfo.com/sri-lanka-v-australia-2011/content/story/522079.html

 

[Spark]

Well that's just bizarre.

 

[Spikey]

I think I raised it here before but Siddle being on the A tour and Dougeh not was also bizarre. Given how realistically Siddle isn't under any pressure for his spot.

 

[pup11]

I don't think there is much wrong with CA being skeptical about Dougie's fitness, people only seem to be talking about how he looked out of sorts during the 2nd Ashes test but its not as if his fitness improved any further after that. Through the ODI series that followed the Ashes he looked uncomfortable in the field and struggled to bowl with any real consistentcy and then he got injured in the worldcup without playing a game.

I think more than fitness its his conditioning that's the real problem, he gives it his all everytime he bowls but when he is bowling in hot, humid conditions there is a very good chance of him breaking down because I don't think his physical conditioning is good enough to allow him to bowl 20 overs or more in a day without losing steam.

The selection of someone like Harris who from all reports has a degenerative knee condition somewhat contradicts the decision to leave out Dougie on fitness grounds, the sensible thing would have been to have both of them in the ODI squad and see how they performed in terms of form and fitness and then decide whether to have them in the test squad or not.

 

[Spark]

I don't think there is much wrong with CA being skeptical about Dougie's fitness, people only seem to be talking about how he looked out of sorts during the 2nd Ashes test but its not as if his fitness improved any further after that. Through the ODI series that followed the Ashes he looked uncomfortable in the field and struggled to bowl with any real consistentcy and then he got injured in the worldcup without playing a game.

I think more than fitness its his conditioning that's the real problem, he gives it his all everytime he bowls but when he is bowling in hot, humid conditions there is a very good chance of him breaking down because I don't think his physical conditioning is good enough to allow him to bowl 20 overs or more in a day without losing steam.

The selection of someone like Harris who from all reports has a degenerative knee condition somewhat contradicts the decision to leave out Dougie on fitness grounds, the sensible thing would have been to have both of them in the ODI squad and see how they performed in terms of form and fitness and then decide whether to have them in the test squad or not.

 

[MW1304]

It is unfair. It's one innings ffs. A bowler with his record should be forgiven for performing poorly once.

Incredibly harshly dealt with.

If it's true that Bollinger is ranked 25th on the contract list behind Patrick Cummins and Xavier Doherty.

Wasn't talking specifically about Bollinger, was making a general point about bowlers. Yes he was treated unfairly by the selectors, but its not unfair that he's being criticised for his levels of fitness. As a bowler, you can't turn up unfit, it's as simple as that.

 

[adub]

He wasn't spraying them second dig... picked up a few good wickets on the 3rd evening and by the time the 4th morning came around Harris was too busy up the other end anyway.

He didn't especially fall apart after that Test. Certainly nowhere near the degree Hilfenhaus did, for example.

Look, I'd love to sit here and say that we've got a better bowler than the erratic, technically flawed and flaky Johnson. But I honestly look at our stocks and I can't say we do. We have the potential for better but that's not good enough at the moment. The best of a average bunch is still the best of an average bunch.

Strauss and Trott were good wickets and on the third evening he was fired up, but my recollection was that he was already noticeably less controlled than the first innings, now maybe that's fair enough because frankly his first innings bowling was some of the most divine left arm over work I've ever seen. Up there with Akram at his best. But on the 4th day I felt you could see that whatever it was that had him so inspired in the first dig was fading away and Mitchell we're more familiar with was coming back. Not terrible, but losing the control he had.

By Melbourne he was going for MORE rpo (4.62) than Doug did in Adelaide. His two wickets were Collingwood smashing a long hop down fine leg's throat and Bell top edging another short one to the same spot. If he wasn't falling apart as bad as Hilf then I'm not sure what you were watching. At least Hilfs wide crud outside off was only going for 2.2 rpo although tbf he didn't look like taking a wicket until Swann and Tremlett gifted him two. In Sydney Johnson did get a couple of real wickets but he again went for over 4.6 rpo. You don't go for 4.6 rpo if you have control. I sometimes wonder if there is some sort of magic field around Johnson that makes people forget just how horrendous his bowling often is.

You admit we have the potential for better than Johnson. Well the useless gimp isn't winning us tests all that often but is costing us plenty. The only way we're ever going to find out if these other guys can convert potential into results is BY ACTUALLY GIVING THEM A GO. Radical thought I know, but it's worked in the past. To actually give them a go means we have to drop someone, someone maybe like Johnson. Crazy thinking I know but in Copeland, Butterworth and Faulkner you have three guys with way better fc bowling records than Johnson, two of whom have better batting records and the third is no mug bunny. I'd better London to a brick at least one of them will be good enough to make people wonder why we didn't drop Johnson years ago. If only we'd actually give them a chance. We are talking about guys whose records are no where near average. They are outstanding, and I reckon guys with outstanding fc records should get a shot in front of guys with poor records at both fc and test level.

Me I say we just accept the whole 'lets base our attack around Johnson, with Siddle and Hilf as his main support' idea has just not worked out and isn't going to work. They've led us from No. 1 to No. 5 and that's a fair reflection of their ability. We owe them nothing and we should give some guys who've performed better at fc level the chance we've given those three. But no lets keep Johnson because hey he's much better than Hilfenhaus, and a little bit better than Siddle.

 

[adub]

well ****. when i decide to make a non-greg chappell post it's usually about how siddle and mj can't be in the same attack because they'll take a 6 wicket haul, do nothing for the next 2-3 tests and then take another 6er and so it's impossible to expect a good bowling attack. i'm now utterly useless. i feel like Hilf.

ps fine with MJ in the team as long as Siddle's not there. He takes wickets. S/R of 53 is up there. But he's not an automatic choice and he's not the leader. He needs a good attack around him. Not Siddle/Hilf/Beer.

Maybe we can arrange a tag team Spikey.

 

[adub]

I don't think there is much wrong with CA being skeptical about Dougie's fitness, people only seem to be talking about how he looked out of sorts during the 2nd Ashes test but its not as if his fitness improved any further after that. Through the ODI series that followed the Ashes he looked uncomfortable in the field and struggled to bowl with any real consistentcy and then he got injured in the worldcup without playing a game.

I think more than fitness its his conditioning that's the real problem, he gives it his all everytime he bowls but when he is bowling in hot, humid conditions there is a very good chance of him breaking down because I don't think his physical conditioning is good enough to allow him to bowl 20 overs or more in a day without losing steam.

The selection of someone like Harris who from all reports has a degenerative knee condition somewhat contradicts the decision to leave out Dougie on fitness grounds, the sensible thing would have been to have both of them in the ODI squad and see how they performed in terms of form and fitness and then decide whether to have them in the test squad or not.

Can't argue with that too much. But I will say I watched a day of Dougs next shield match after Adelaide and he didn't show any signs of fitness problems. He was charging in and took a pair of 3-fers. As noted his treatment compared to a guy with a known knee issue is chalk and cheese. I think it has very little to do with his fitness at all. That's just a cover. He simply isn't part of the clique.

 

[adub]

I think I raised it here before but Siddle being on the A tour and Dougeh not was also bizarre. Given how realistically Siddle isn't under any pressure for his spot.

It's only explicable if you don't actually want Bollinger to have the chance to prove his form and fitness.

 

[pup11]

Haha.. well Harris has had problems with his knee ever since he put on that extra yard of pace and recently he had a knee surgery that kept him out of action for 4-5 months, now its pretty common knowledge that once your knee starts to give you trouble then it becomes pretty hard for an athlete to perform upto his optimum levels.

 

[adub]

The one massive difference between the two is that Johnson didn't bowl like crap because he'd run out of puff. As much as CA have to take some of the blame for Bollinger's condition leading into Adelaide, rocking up unfit is a pretty unforgiveable sin IMO.

So bowling poorly because you've run out of puff after two days slogging away on a road in 40 degrees after having a reduced lead up is unforgiveable, but bowling like crap with not a thing in the world wrong with you and a full preparation behind you is just par for the course?

Give me a call when you get back from bizarro world and we'll do lunch.

 

[Furball]

Strauss and Trott were good wickets and on the third evening he was fired up, but my recollection was that he was already noticeably less controlled than the first innings, now maybe that's fair enough because frankly his first innings bowling was some of the most divine left arm over work I've ever seen. Up there with Akram at his best. But on the 4th day I felt you could see that whatever it was that had him so inspired in the first dig was fading away and Mitchell we're more familiar with was coming back. Not terrible, but losing the control he had.

By Melbourne he was going for MORE rpo (4.62) than Doug did in Adelaide. His two wickets were Collingwood smashing a long hop down fine leg's throat and Bell top edging another short one to the same spot. If he wasn't falling apart as bad as Hilf then I'm not sure what you were watching. At least Hilfs wide crud outside off was only going for 2.2 rpo although tbf he didn't look like taking a wicket until Swann and Tremlett gifted him two. In Sydney Johnson did get a couple of real wickets but he again went for over 4.6 rpo. You don't go for 4.6 rpo if you have control. I sometimes wonder if there is some sort of magic field around Johnson that makes people forget just how horrendous his bowling often is.

You admit we have the potential for better than Johnson. Well the useless gimp isn't winning us tests all that often but is costing us plenty. The only way we're ever going to find out if these other guys can convert potential into results is BY ACTUALLY GIVING THEM A GO. Radical thought I know, but it's worked in the past. To actually give them a go means we have to drop someone, someone maybe like Johnson. Crazy thinking I know but in Copeland, Butterworth and Faulkner you have three guys with way better fc bowling records than Johnson, two of whom have better batting records and the third is no mug bunny. I'd better London to a brick at least one of them will be good enough to make people wonder why we didn't drop Johnson years ago. If only we'd actually give them a chance. We are talking about guys whose records are no where near average. They are outstanding, and I reckon guys with outstanding fc records should get a shot in front of guys with poor records at both fc and test level.

Me I say we just accept the whole 'lets base our attack around Johnson, with Siddle and Hilf as his main support' idea has just not worked out and isn't going to work. They've led us from No. 1 to No. 5 and that's a fair reflection of their ability. We owe them nothing and we should give some guys who've performed better at fc level the chance we've given those three. But no lets keep Johnson because hey he's much better than Hilfenhaus, and a little bit better than Siddle.

He's winning you more Tests than any of your other quicks though.

While I think Bollinger has been harshly done by, at the end of the day running out of puff and throwing down barely medium paced crap looks pretty bad, and it's not as if he's done much in the interim to convince the selectors of his fitness - he got sent home from the World Cup for being unfit did he not?

 

[Spikey]

Ankle injury

 

[Burgey]

If you include Johnson's batting though, it is pretty debatable who is the more valuable player. I definately think Bollinger is a better bowler than Johnson, but I don't think he is that much better. His current record flatters him somewhat because he has faced some pretty average batting line-ups. While Dougie should definately be in the team in place of someone like Siddle imo, I honestly don't think him replacing Johnson would make much of a difference to the teams success.

If they have a choice They won't pick them both because they're left handers. Their first preference is two right hand sealers and a left hander.

Lucky for us then Alan Davidson and Wasim Akram aren't both contemporary Australian fast bowlers. One of them would be in Shield cricket because we'd prefer Hilf and Sid.

Go us.

 

[Burgey]

He's winning you more Tests than any of your other quicks though.

While I think Bollinger has been harshly done by, at the end of the day running out of puff and throwing down barely medium paced crap looks pretty bad, and it's not as if he's done much in the interim to convince the selectors of his fitness - he got sent home from the World Cup for being unfit did he not?

Consistent success at Test level will come from your quicks bowling consistently as a pack though.

 

[Spikey]

We've learnt from our mistakes and have decided to play the exact same team.

 

[Spikey]

No wait! Haddin's gonna bat at six and Smith at seven. Well that changes everything

 

[SamSawnoff]

Consistent success at Test level will come from your quicks bowling consistently as a pack though.

Yep, which Johnson isn't capable of doing that often.