Howsie
International Captain
Yeah, definitely. How many times has Nathan McCullum actually bowled his allotment of overs in his career? It can't have been very often.
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*Official* Match 18 - New Zealand v Zimbabwe
- Thread starter James
- Start date
wellAlbidarned
International Coach
Patel and Mccullum are not quality. Guptill is obviously the worst case, but it's a problem shown by most NZ batsmen-they just allow spinners to bowl a teasing short of a half volley length, never getting forward enough to force the length back.
wellAlbidarned
International Coach
"Pace", if you can really call it that, into the attack. Guppeh springs into action.
Athlai
Not Terrible
Not international quality maybe but certainly right up there in terms of domestic spinners around the world.
wellAlbidarned
International Coach
Last time I checked, "good" domestic spinners didn't average 40+ against hapless NZ domestic batsmen. Yeah, you could say the pitches aren't suited, and that's probably true, but the factors should cancel each other out to some extent.
Flem274*
123/5
I have a theory on Guptill's problem, and it is only a theory and could be completely wrong, but it's a good one imo.
He has cruised through the grades on ability, without having to do much hard work. If you're awesome on the front foot and have an incredible eye, you're away in NZ domestics traditionally. I don't know how heavily he has scored in Auckland club cricket, but he was picked for test cricket on ODI runs. He has a FC average of 26 for Auckland. He's been elevated without having to do too much. Once he scored that debut century in ODIs (with a bit of luck) he was going to play test cricket. That's how our selectors roll.
And we know aesthetics is the way to get picked for NZ, not actual runs or wickets. Is it any surprise our team looks flash but sucks when we select like this?
Guptill has tons of ability and a reasonable technique, but I suspect prior to FC cricket he had never met an equal, and in List A he dominates as well, so he first met a limited overs equal in ODIs.
Doesn't surprise me he's not hitting the ground running.
He has cruised through the grades on ability, without having to do much hard work. If you're awesome on the front foot and have an incredible eye, you're away in NZ domestics traditionally. I don't know how heavily he has scored in Auckland club cricket, but he was picked for test cricket on ODI runs. He has a FC average of 26 for Auckland. He's been elevated without having to do too much. Once he scored that debut century in ODIs (with a bit of luck) he was going to play test cricket. That's how our selectors roll.
And we know aesthetics is the way to get picked for NZ, not actual runs or wickets. Is it any surprise our team looks flash but sucks when we select like this?
Guptill has tons of ability and a reasonable technique, but I suspect prior to FC cricket he had never met an equal, and in List A he dominates as well, so he first met a limited overs equal in ODIs.
Doesn't surprise me he's not hitting the ground running.
Howsie
International Captain
Aside from perhaps Ryder and Williamson most batsmen in the current New Zealand team just commit too early and end up getting themselves into all sorts of problems against the spinners.
wellAlbidarned
International Coach
Cremer needs a bit more overspin IMO-doesn't really seem to be getting much dip through the air, or spit and bounce off the pitch.
Flem274*
123/5
I don't. Third worst FC spinner in the country.
Athlai
Not Terrible
Second best as well.
Hurricane
Hall of Fame Member
NZ is weak for spin. Most people want to bowl seam in this country.
Nate
You'll Never Walk Alone
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your theory, but I plain don't understand the criticism Guptill receives. He averages 36 in ODIs, which is perfectly acceptable (especially for a New Zealand batsman), he just fails to go on with starts a bit. I'm sure as he progresses in his International Career, he will go on to rectify that problem (somewhat).
Smudge
Hall of Fame Member
Good thing I didn't put the bet on...
Nate
You'll Never Walk Alone
I never said anything about quality being a factor.
Flem274*
123/5
We should play the FC Spinners better than Jeetan Patel game again.
Todd Astle
Nick Beard
Bhuphinder Epicbeard
Athlai
Not Terrible
lol wot r u smkin?We should play the FC Spinners better than Jeetan Patel game again.
Todd Astle
Nick Beard
Bhuphinder Epicbeard
wellAlbidarned
International Coach
It's because he looks like he could do so much more, unlike the rest of our batsmen.
Unfortunately for him, his key problems stick out worse than a (insert hilarious similie here).
-Playing spin
-Repeatedly getting out after starts
-Rotating the strike
Seriously. I love every part of his game except those three areas.