*Official* South Africa in West Indies

[TT Boy]

They are trying their level back to get the chokers tag back...

McLaren is not a REAL all-rounder material. He is horrible with bat!

Shades of Graeme Pollock on the onside but more like Jackson Pollock on the off-side.

Time and place for McLaren and the wicket was too true for him today; he needs to be wheeled out on the dog wickets.

 

[Neil Pickup]

Watching WI v SA has been hilarious this series, as both sides do their utmost to avoid winning.

 

[Prince EWS]

Erm well he also did get 69 against a South Africa A team that contained some of the bowlers that are currently playing in this series Mike!!, so he wasn't just a "flat track bully" like you seem to be implying, i'm not surprised by your position of course because as i've said many times before you're content with the status quo, despite the fact that they keep failing us time and time again, i don't believe Dowlin "deserves" anything, he was shambolic in Australia just like Morton and Hinds was.

I'm not a big fan of Dowlin but it's completely unfair to judge his Test prospects based on how he played in the ODIs. It's something you do time and time again - confuse the two forms of the game. Dowlin was dire in the ODIs in Australia but it's pretty obvious that is game isn't suited to ODI cricket, and in the two Tests he played over here he scored two half centuries. He was fine.

Blacklist him from ODIs if you wish but his Test selection shouldn't hinge and his performances in a format he never should have been picked for.

 

[TT Boy]

Why the **** did Boucher play this game if he was going to be used as a specialist batsman?

Surely South Africa could've found a better specialist batsman to pick, and surely even if they couldn't, Boucher would get the gloves ahead of De Villiers. Just makes so little sense.

They just run out of batsman. Miller was injured, Bosman was given leave to go take apart county attacks and Virus wasn't in their plans. Boucher's limited overs career is all but finished and was just performing a role today.

 

[kingkallis]

Lopsy's first boundary in T20s. Get in son.

Ermm, that happens due to the overdose of T20s...

 

[Jarquis]

Ermm, that happens due to the overdose of T20s...

 

[Beamer]

Need to find a way to lose a match from any position?

Call the West Indies cricket team on 1-800-LOSE-A-LOT or visit our website at www.outchokethechokers.com.

 

[WindieWeathers]

I'm not a big fan of Dowlin but it's completely unfair to judge his Test prospects based on how he played in the ODIs. It's something you do time and time again - confuse the two forms of the game. Dowlin was dire in the ODIs in Australia but it's pretty obvious that is game isn't suited to ODI cricket, and in the two Tests he played over here he scored two half centuries. He was fine.

Blacklist him from ODIs if you wish but his Test selection shouldn't hinge and his performances in a format he never should have been picked for.

Excuse me where have i "confused the two formats"?!! you have a habit of throwing that accusation at me and in most cases it's a complete fallacy, i was referring to ALL of his performances in OZ, not just the ODI's, yes he scored a few 50's in the Tests so what? the guy simply didn't look comfortable at the crease and was too easily bogged down, he'd be a wicket waiting to happen against the likes of Steyn and Morkel, even in the recent A-team four day games against Bangledash he was second best to Darren Bravo, the same Darren Bravo who Mike claims "isn't ready".

 

[Johnners]

And which "players" are supporting him then? if you're talking about Gibbo's comments i think that's a feeble argument, Gibbo was always gonna play down the situation but clearly the dust hasn't settled because Benn has been dropped, and i'm talking about Gayles form since the ODI's in Australia, he must have had one good game since then in the T20 cup against India and that's it,

As an outsider you might look at Gayle's past performances with admiration but the fact is i follow this side and his form of late has verged on shambolic to average, if his performances improve in the Test series then fair enough but right now he looks like a man bereft of confidence.

Unless you have some insider info as to what each individual player thinks (would love to hear this if it's the case?), what else can we go by than what is being reported in the media? If you seriously think the largest portion of the blame behind players rebelling lies at Gayles feet, I'd suggest that can seemingly be explained by the fact that the only players who have had trouble, are players who have had attitude problems in the past (or if they didn't, admitted they were in the wrong this time around...). In any case it seemed pretty clear to me by what we're hearing that Gibson has supported Gayles actions of late (this instance with Benn, along with calls for his batsmen to be more responsible, so it isn't a once off) and there seems no reason to suspect the players don't either.

Re: Gayles performances, sure he had a rubbish ODI series vs Australia, but despite not setting the world alight ,seems to have been playing better since then. In any case, given he's been a proven ODI & Test match performer in the past, and has been it seems incredibly harsh to play the "he doesn't contribute" card when using it as an example as to why players may not respect him. If they cannot respect him for what he has contributed as recent as his last test match, let alone his entire career (which has been comfortably more successful than a number of the other players put together...) then it seems quite obvious to me which party has the attitude problem.

FTR, just because I said I'm a neutral, it doesn't mean I don't follow what actually happens with the team.

 

[GotSpin]

Gayle has been delivering with the ball as well recently.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Unless you have some insider info as to what each individual player thinks (would love to hear this if it's the case?), what else can we go by than what is being reported in the media? If you seriously think the largest portion of the blame behind players rebelling lies at Gayles feet, I'd suggest that can seemingly be explained by the fact that the only players who have had trouble, are players who have had attitude problems in the past (or if they didn't, admitted they were in the wrong this time around...). In any case it seemed pretty clear to me by what we're hearing that Gibson has supported Gayles actions of late (this instance with Benn, along with calls for his batsmen to be more responsible, so it isn't a once off) and there seems no reason to suspect the players don't either.

Re: Gayles performances, sure he had a rubbish ODI series vs Australia, but despite not setting the world alight ,seems to have been playing better since then. In any case, given he's been a proven ODI & Test match performer in the past, and has been it seems incredibly harsh to play the "he doesn't contribute" card when using it as an example as to why players may not respect him. If they cannot respect him for what he has contributed as recent as his last test match, let alone his entire career (which has been comfortably more successful than a number of the other players put together...) then it seems quite obvious to me which party has the attitude problem.

FTR, just because I said I'm a neutral, it doesn't mean I don't follow what actually happens with the team.

You only have to look at Gayle's antics yesterday, failed with the bat again, ok he didn't do too bad with the ball but his decision to keep Pollard and Bravo in the last two overs were ridiculous and IMO cost us the game, Bravo was clearly struggling and Pollard is NOT a death bowler, it's especially baffling when you consider Sammy bowled well in the few overs he had too, it's as if Gayle put his issues with Sammy before the good of the team which is why i don't believe he's leading the team competently and i don't think he's as "popular" with the players as Gibbo suggests.

 

[shivfan]

Still amazes me that a guy like Pollard, who runs in a fair old distance, has a seriously athletic physique and a wealth of professional coaching available to him is barely capable of bowling 70mph. Looks capable of bowling much faster than that if he actually put some effort in.

I agree....

Surely, Pollard can add a few mph to his pace, and try to become a genuine allrounder. He would do well to look at Kallis, and even though the Saffer is miles better than him, that's who he should be trying to emulate.

 

[shivfan]

I'm not a big fan of Dowlin but it's completely unfair to judge his Test prospects based on how he played in the ODIs. It's something you do time and time again - confuse the two forms of the game. Dowlin was dire in the ODIs in Australia but it's pretty obvious that is game isn't suited to ODI cricket, and in the two Tests he played over here he scored two half centuries. He was fine.

Blacklist him from ODIs if you wish but his Test selection shouldn't hinge and his performances in a format he never should have been picked for.

I completely agree....

The Windies were right to omit him from the just-concluded ODI series, but anyone who has a Test batting average of 41 in this current WI squad clearly deserves to be in consideration, especially if Sarwan is injured and can't play in the first Test. I'm not a fan of Dowlin, but he has earned the right to play in the Test side, based upon past experiences.

Windie, how many current WI batsmen have a better Test batting average than Dowlin?

Sure, he might fail against SOuth Africa, and we can then wave goodbye to him. But based on that recent Test record, he deserves to play in this upcoming Test series....

 

[shivfan]

Excuse me where have i "confused the two formats"?!! you have a habit of throwing that accusation at me and in most cases it's a complete fallacy, i was referring to ALL of his performances in OZ, not just the ODI's, yes he scored a few 50's in the Tests so what? the guy simply didn't look comfortable at the crease and was too easily bogged down, he'd be a wicket waiting to happen against the likes of Steyn and Morkel, even in the recent A-team four day games against Bangledash he was second best to Darren Bravo, the same Darren Bravo who Mike claims "isn't ready".

You're making a big mistake if you think that scoring runs on flat batting tracks against the Bangladesh reserves is ideal preparation for facing up arguably the best bowling attack from one of the top Test teams in the game today. There's a big difference between facing Shuvo, and encountering Steyn and co. As several posters have rightly said on caribbeancricket.com, if you push Darren Bravo into the Test team too early, you run the risk of making him into another Xavier Marshall....

He will get his chance to play Test cricket. Let him further his education by learning how to play on the seaming English wickets on that A team tour. He will never get a chance like that again. Too many WI batsmen find the idea of moving their feet while they're in their crease an alien concept.

 

[shivfan]

This would be my team for the first Test....

1) Chris Gayle
2) Adrian Barath (Travis Dowlin, if Barath's still injured)
3) Ramnaresh Sarwan (Narsing Deonarine, if Sarwan's still injured)
4) Shiv Chanderpaul
5) Brendan Nash
6) Dwayne Bravo
7) Denesh Ramdin (still the best keeper for Tests)
8) Jerome Taylor (if he hasn't hurt himself too much in the ODIs)
9) Suleimann Benn
10) Kemar Roach
11) Shane Shillingford

I must admit, I like Windie's idea of playing two spinners on a turning Trinidad pitch. Bravo is there to be first change seamer. My main concern is the injury front, as can be seen from my several 'ifs'....

 

[dravid&kallis]

Smith with the trophy

I see Graeme Smith holding the ODI series trophy here Graeme Smith with the trophy | Cricket Photo | Cricinfo.com

The trophy is in the form of a bowler. Who is he?

 

[dravid&kallis]

I don't think WI can compete even if the 1st test wicket is a turner. I don't see how the likes of Benn can trouble the Proteas. The key to WI attack is Roach & Taylor taking wickets with the new ball.

I would be more than happy to see a contest and not see WI blown away as was the case with the ODIs.

WI may fare better against SA with the bat than with ball. So expect WI to make decent totals.

Series prediction : 3 - 0 in favour of SA.

My fav batsmen : Hashim Amla, Rahul Dravid, Ross Taylor
Fav teams : SA, IND, NZ
Preferred format : Tests
T20 v 50 Ov : T20
Batting or bowling : Enjoy watching batting more than bowling. The bowlers hardly have any say nowadays even in tests!
Duminy v Prince : Prince permanent for the next 8 tests in the middle order.

 

[WindieWeathers]

You're making a big mistake if you think that scoring runs on flat batting tracks against the Bangladesh reserves is ideal preparation for facing up arguably the best bowling attack from one of the top Test teams in the game today. There's a big difference between facing Shuvo, and encountering Steyn and co. As several posters have rightly said on caribbeancricket.com, if you push Darren Bravo into the Test team too early, you run the risk of making him into another Xavier Marshall....

He will get his chance to play Test cricket. Let him further his education by learning how to play on the seaming English wickets on that A team tour. He will never get a chance like that again. Too many WI batsmen find the idea of moving their feet while they're in their crease an alien concept.

Dowlin couldn't even score a ton against Bang on the flat tracks recently and you're advocating his selection while dismissing Bravo? HE'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH MIKE!!, it's that simple, Bravo has all the strokes in the book and needs experience now, it was only a few days ago that he was toying with the likes of Morkel so i don't think he'll be fearing them in the Tests, using X-man as an example is old and played out Mike, because like i've said before you have to judge each player by THEIR OWN merits,

You asked for "tons" in the recent A-team tour and Bravo delivered two, now you're moving the goalposts in order to accommodate dads army? i find that logic not only boring, but totally uninspiring.

 

[Briony]

Dowlin shouldn't be considered. Go for some young, fresh blood.

Is Smith's place in jeopardy? He appears to be in the worst form of his career atm and is definitely Bravo's bunny.

 

[popepouri]

I think Lopsy has done well enough to get a go in tests and because it's his preferred format). Also, he's a left-armer which adds a bit more variety than if they went with Ntini again.