Player's Averages - What will they end with?

[BoyBrumby]

I'm afraid that's just incorrect. Unless of course England start playing even more tests against crap teams. Even then I doubt it, his technique is very reliant on his reflexes (so he can generate that bat speed and play the ball late) and having a really good eye. As any batsmen will tell you these are the first 2 things to go which will make him very vulnerable to the effects of age. I mean look how King Viv tailed off towards the end of his career. Also once he gets a hundred in South Africa I think he may have some issues with motivation. Also if you count Sangakkarra as being in the same generation, there simply isn't any contest, he's ridiculously good, his 194 at Hobart was right up there with the best I've ever seen, Pietersen hasn't an innings that can touch that for class and quality of batting.

Pietersen's test career by opponents.

It's fair to say the two best test sides are pretty much universally regarded as South Africa and Australia, against whom KP averages 60.14 & 53.50 respectively, as opposed to a career figure of 51.09. The stats suggest he raises his game for the better teams, rather than bullies the minnows.

Moreover, don't be fooled by the bravado and the bull****: Pietersen's technique is rock solid. Plays ramrod straight and never tees off from the word go, always takes the time to play himself in. As he ages we might not see so many one-footed flamingo whips or reverse lofted on-drives, but he has the basics to go on as long as the desire is there.

 

[oitoitoi]

Pietersen's test career by opponents.

It's fair to say the two best test sides are pretty much universally regarded as South Africa and Australia, against whom KP averages 60.14 & 53.50 respectively, as opposed to a career figure of 51.09. The stats suggest he raises his game for the better teams, rather than bullies the minnows.

Moreover, don't be fooled by the bravado and the bull****: Pietersen's technique is rock solid. Plays ramrod straight and never tees off from the word go, always takes the time to play himself in. As he ages we might not see so many one-footed flamingo whips or reverse lofted on-drives, but he has the basics to go on as long as the desire is there.

Firstly I'd disagree saying that India are the best test side around right now, best batting line up, IMO best captain, best new ball attack (SA are too inconsistent other than Steyn) and best attack on flat wickets.

I definitely disagree with the point about him having a solid technique, he's had it exploited several times, most clinically by Mohammed Asif, (go back and watch the dismissals on youtube) Mcgrath in his prime could have made him his bunny with those kind of dismissals, Ambrose too. The gap between bat and pad appears far too often for him to be called solid. Also it's no secret that he doesn't like the short ball, he almost always tries to pull off the front foot, a cardinal sin as far as technique goes. Good short pitched bowling seems to get him in a tangle too much, remember that throat ball from Malinga, it was a good ball but KP made it a lot better. There's an awful lot more to technique than playing straight.

 

[Evermind]

Firstly I'd disagree saying that India are the best test side around right now, best batting line up, IMO best captain, best new ball attack (SA are too inconsistent other than Steyn) and best attack on flat wickets.

Stats on paper don't count. Let them win ONE away series against Australia and South Africa and get back to me. Until then, I don't see how anyone could possibly argue how India are #1. A definite third. It's all about results, I'm afraid. Not "almost won the Sydney test" or "won 13 sessions out of 15" sorta bull**** - just real, concrete results. Australia beat SA in SA, SA beat Australia in Australia. Have India done that yet? Not in decades. Let's see it first.

Wondering: have India ever actually won a series in Australia or SA?

 

[BoyBrumby]

Firstly I'd disagree saying that India are the best test side around right now, best batting line up, IMO best captain, best new ball attack (SA are too inconsistent other than Steyn) and best attack on flat wickets.

I definitely disagree with the point about him having a solid technique, he's had it exploited several times, most clinically by Mohammed Asif, (go back and watch the dismissals on youtube) Mcgrath in his prime could have made him his bunny with those kind of dismissals, Ambrose too. The gap between bat and pad appears far too often for him to be called solid. Also it's no secret that he doesn't like the short ball, he almost always tries to pull off the front foot, a cardinal sin as far as technique goes. Good short pitched bowling seems to get him in a tangle too much, remember that throat ball from Malinga, it was a good ball but KP made it a lot better. There's an awful lot more to technique than playing straight.

Pffft.

I doubt many non-Indian supporters would agree.

& Asif played one test against him, in which (if memory serves) Pietersen made 96 before succombing to a rush of blood. Hardly the most clinical of exploitations.

 

[Uppercut]

Pffft.

I doubt many non-Indian supporters would agree.

& Asif played one test against him, in which (if memory serves) Pietersen made 96 before succombing to a rush of blood. Hardly the most clinical of exploitations.

You could make a decent case for India being the best test side around these days, but they're certainly not the hardest to bat against given conditions there as opposed to somewhere like South Africa. Technical flaws are often exposed moreso in New Zealand than anywhere else in fact, although their current weakness somewhat cancels that out.

Nevertheless, KP's century against India at Lord's a couple of summers back was one of the toughest I've ever seen. There's plenty of innings that could be used to debunk the notion of KP having technical flaws to be exploited.

 

[oitoitoi]

Well I was at Lords and actually saw KP's hundred from a fantastic box seat (a bookie friend's) it was good but the conditions weren't that hard (the pitch was a belter, both sides' batting underperformed really, I remember during the latter half of his innings the clouds cleared for a bit and the ball stopped swinging. India also fed his leg side shots an awful lot. Please enlighten me as to the 'plenty of innings' that dispel his technical weaknesses.

As to the Asif point, watch the one day dismissals after, he clearly had him worked out, short of a length on off stump (basically the bowled Mcgrath ct Healy ball, KP just kept trying to muscle through the on side. I believe he got him 4 times in a row.

I find the 'non-indian supporters' comment to smack of the English post-imperial superiority (or eventually inferiority) complex and very insulting. It's the same attitude that allowed their players and administration to treat the Sri Lankans so unbelievably badly in the early 90's.

 

[BoyBrumby]

I find the 'non-indian supporters' comment to smack of the English post-imperial superiority (or eventually inferiority) complex and very insulting. It's the same attitude that allowed their players and administration to treat the Sri Lankans so unbelievably badly in the early 90's.

Jesus, chippy, much?

We English do nothing but talk up Australian & South African test teams all day long, obviously.

 

[Flem274*]

Jesus, chippy, much?

We English do nothing but talk up Australian & South African test teams all day long, obviously.

Think it depends on who you're playing. If its against a team you think you can beat, the English can be horrible. conversely, the English can fawn all over teams believed to be superior.

 

[Uppercut]

Firstly I'd disagree saying that India are the best test side around right now, best batting line up, IMO best captain, best new ball attack (SA are too inconsistent other than Steyn) and best attack on flat wickets.

I doubt many non-Indian supporters would agree.

I find the 'non-indian supporters' comment to smack of the English post-imperial superiority (or eventually inferiority) complex and very insulting. It's the same attitude that allowed their players and administration to treat the Sri Lankans so unbelievably badly in the early 90's.

Lol. Some definite sand-in-the-vag there.

 

[pskov]

Looking through the first three or so pages of this thread and reading the optimistic afterglow of the 2005 Ashes is very depressing.

 

[Migara]

KP will score a ****load of runs. Because spin has become a dying art. He had upperhand on Muarli and Warne on first meetings, but then Murali turned things around, and sadly Warne retired before he got another go at KP, where I would think would have come on top. Those two are so good bowlers to be overwhelmed by Pietersen.

 

[Migara]

As to the Asif point, watch the one day dismissals after, he clearly had him worked out, short of a length on off stump (basically the bowled Mcgrath ct Healy ball, KP just kept trying to muscle through the on side. I believe he got him 4 times in a row.

And later Maharoof and Fernado got him with the same ball. Getting out to Fernado is a shame for any good batsman, because he's so crap.

 

[Burpmybelly]

Ian Belly will wind up with an average around 50.

 

[SJS]

Pffft.

I doubt many non-Indian supporters would agree.

& Asif played one test against him, in which (if memory serves) Pietersen made 96 before succombing to a rush of blood. Hardly the most clinical of exploitations.

One doesn't have to be a non-Indian supporter to disagree with that gentleman said. I disagree and I have been an Indian supporter for over half a century

 

[BoyBrumby]

One doesn't have to be a non-Indian supporter to disagree with that gentleman said. I disagree and I have been an Indian supporter for over half a century

No, fair enough, I'm sure most Indian supporters are the same too & I honestly intended no offence or slight. I just meant I would doubt any unbiased cricket followers would claim the Indian team as better than SA or Australia currently, although they are certainly snapping at their heels and improving.

 

[zaremba]

I find the 'non-indian supporters' comment to smack of the English post-imperial superiority (or eventually inferiority) complex and very insulting. It's the same attitude that allowed their players and administration to treat the Sri Lankans so unbelievably badly in the early 90's.

Blimey.

 

[Athlai]

Jesse Ryder anyone? Averaging 50+ at the moment.

WAG

 

[Uppercut]

Jesse Ryder anyone? Averaging 50+ at the moment.

WAG

Liable to do something stupid at any time though. Can see him ruling himself out for eight months after drunkenly riding a trolley down a hill into a wall or something.

 

[Bahnz]

Jesse Ryder anyone? Averaging 50+ at the moment.

WAG

I reckon Ryder will finish averaging about 46/47 and Taylor will got about 40/41.

 

[Athlai]

Liable to do something stupid at any time though. Can see him ruling himself out for eight months after drunkenly riding a trolley down a hill into a wall or something.

Yeah him and Flintoff will probably have a trolley race at some stage. Inevitable really.