Are Kolpak players hurting English cricket?

[Langeveldt]

Just to put things in perspective. Some individual Prep schools (lets say 40 boys in the year group) in South Africa are the equiv of County junior reps teams of the same age. We know that because they play each other in festivals.

Any country side that takes school sport so seriously that they put it on TV should inherently be better than England.. However, I don't think tightening the Kolpak laws will stop the SA talent exodus.. Better pay and the total abolishment of the Quota system will..

 

[Richard]

Any bright ideas for improving the rates of pay in SA cricket?

 

[wpdavid]

Any country side that takes school sport so seriously that they put it on TV should inherently be better than England..

That astonished me. How much schools cricket is shown then?

 

[Goughy]

This article is a little dramatic for my tastes.
Rape of SA's Resources

Using the terms 'rape' and 'plunder' for a situation when people are electing to do this of their own accord and may be doing their own damage to English cricket is stupid.

 

[Langeveldt]

This article is a little dramatic for my tastes.
Rape of SA's Resources

Using the terms 'rape' and 'plunder' for a situation when people are electing to do this of their own accord and may be doing their own damage to English cricket is stupid.

An interesting article by Neil Manthorp on the Supersport website said that one of the benifits to SA cricket are, at least we know that the 11 national players wearing the green and gold can't be accused of being in it for the money

 

[TT Boy]

Any bright ideas for improving the rates of pay in SA cricket?

They are already paid comfortably more than the majority of South Africans, the question is whether they are paid enough to afford the extension on their four bedroom ‘house’ or are given the required capital to invest in cattle ranches, wineries et cetera.

But until the South African economy is as strong as Western Europe (which will never happen) than of course South African cricketers like South African doctors, nurses, engineers et cetera, who are White and Black will always look for a better ‘deal’ abroad, its human nature and the cricketers unlike the aforementioned professionals have a great excuse to mask their economic want, the quota system.

 

[Goughy]

They are already paid comfortably more than the majority of South Africans, the question is whether they are paid enough to afford the extension on their four bedroom ‘house’ or are given the required capital to invest in cattle ranches, wineries et cetera.

But until the South African economy is as strong as Western Europe (which will never happen) than of course South African cricketers like South African doctors, nurses, engineers et cetera, who are White and Black will always look for a better ‘deal’ abroad, its human nature and the cricketers unlike the aforementioned professionals have a great excuse to mask their economic want, the quota system.

Wow, well spun. Talk about making something bad (ie quotas) into a victim.

Simple fact is that both quotas and economics play a roll. For each player the balance is different.

They dovetail together. Why struggle in a low paid job when there is little-no chance of selection when a better offer is available that makes you feel wanted and less dis-illusioned.

With Kolpaks we are not really seeing the top leave. Its those on the fringes of selection that feel marginalised. The 2nd tier, the young and the old.

Sure guys are cashing in, but dont underestimate the dis-illusionment that makes the money more tempting and attractive.

 

[Langeveldt]

That astonished me. How much schools cricket is shown then?

The sport predominantly shown is rugby.. They usually show a schools game before an international match, kind of like the warm up as the bars start filling up. I don't have a schedule, but the main website owned by the television company is www.superschools.co.za

Typical cricket coverage.. These are just fairly bog standard private schools and they get this amount of coverage..
http://www.superschools.co.za/article.asp?aId=243660&sportCategory=SUPERSCHOOLS/SCHOOLSCRICKET

 

[wpdavid]

I know it's been discussed as a possibility, but i wasn't expecting this.

http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/england/content/current/story/354444.html

 

[Langeveldt]

I know it's been discussed as a possibility, but i wasn't expecting this.

http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/england/content/current/story/354444.html

If the ECB were to limit the number of Kolpaks, wouldn't there be some sort of rebellion by the counties?

 

[Richard]

The ECB butters the counties' bread. There are all sorts of ways ECB executives could make life hell for those who try to stop any such change going through.

I'd absolutely love Kolpak stuff to be completely ruled-out starting with a phasing processs from next season... or at least confined exclusively to players of the highest calibre.

 

[Goughy]

With 60+ Kolpaks in County cricket, Im starting to worry how bad the standard will be once it is phased out.


A number of aspects of Kolpaks are negative but the alternative is pretty bleak as well.

 

[Manee]

There is a distinct possibility that if these often high level players are phased out, then the level of competition between players will be more equal and so less celebrated players may begin to excel.

 

[stumpski]

Something had to be done though didn't it, or a few years down the line we'd have the prospect of teams taking the field without a single England qualified player. A few of the Kolpak players are useful additions to their teams, but too many of them are not noticeably better than those whose places they've taken.

 

[wpdavid]

Won't they simply become "overseas players" again? So it's not as if none of them will play over here. If that did happen, you could see a limit overseas players of 2 per county being reasonable.

 

[BoyBrumby]

With 60+ Kolpaks in County cricket, Im starting to worry how bad the standard will be once it is phased out.

I think the unpalatable truth is that we do have too many first-class entities for the English/British player base to sustain. More people play cricket in Australia in real as well as pro-rata terms, but they do very well on only 6 FC states.

It's also the teams most in danger of the chop (in my estimation, obviously) who are most reliant on Kolpaks. I'm thinking here of Northants, Derbyshire & Leicestershire, primarily. As a fan myself I sympathise with supporters of any team that might cease to exist (in its current form, at any rate), but if these counties aren't self-sufficient financially and are propped up with southern African playing talent they become a net drain on resources.

 

[stumpski]

The result may be that counties end up trimming their playing staff, which might not be a bad thing. Just looking at Derbyshire's squad - one of the poorer (and weaker) counties, and they have 26 on their books including three wicket-keepers. Now obviously they have to field a 2nd XI, but that should be made up of fringe players, first teamers out of form, under 21s and a selection of the best local club players. It could be 50% amateur. No reason why counties shouldn't be able to manage with 20 or 21 full-timers.

 

[Langeveldt]

Won't they simply become "overseas players" again? So it's not as if none of them will play over here. If that did happen, you could see a limit overseas players of 2 per county being reasonable.

Haha, sounds familiar..

 

[Richard]

Won't they simply become "overseas players" again? So it's not as if none of them will play over here. If that did happen, you could see a limit overseas players of 2 per county being reasonable.

Never thought that at all. Always thought one per county was fine - and this was in the days before anyone had discovered that they could play in the country because of a British great-grandparent, never mind an EU-qualified grandparent, never never mind a trade agreement between the EU and their country.

One overseas player suits me fine.

 

[Richard]

With 60+ Kolpaks in County cricket, Im starting to worry how bad the standard will be once it is phased out.


A number of aspects of Kolpaks are negative but the alternative is pretty bleak as well.

The result may be that counties end up trimming their playing staff, which might not be a bad thing. Just looking at Derbyshire's squad - one of the poorer (and weaker) counties, and they have 26 on their books including three wicket-keepers. Now obviously they have to field a 2nd XI, but that should be made up of fringe players, first teamers out of form, under 21s and a selection of the best local club players. It could be 50% amateur. No reason why counties shouldn't be able to manage with 20 or 21 full-timers.

My thoughts precisely. Staffs have been far too big for far too long, there's no way 18 counties need two-thirds of the players currently on full-time contracts (would be interested to see exactly what that is, incidentally). The money would be far better spent in other ways.