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Official Pro-Wrestling Thread (WWE, TNA, ROH etc.)

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masterblaster

International Captain
Yeah, absolutely spot on. It seems like an old record when I say this, but again, back about 5 years ago, hell even 2-3 years ago, WWE was never quite as predictable as it is now. It seems that the general pattern for world titles is <number one contender feuds with champion - loses match at ppv - rematch/blowoff victory at next ppv - new champion beats fodder challengers for about 2-4 months - loses title to new serious contender>.
Even when Brock Lesnar and Eddie Guerrero were champions, WWE was pretty fun to watch. Whenever there was a Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle match up and you didn't read the spoilers, you honestly wouldn't know who would be going over and they had fantastic matches too. Whilst the late 90's and early 2000's were undoubtedly great there were some great moments too in 2003.
 
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sledger

Spanish_Vicente
Agreed, understand about Kane and Undertaker but they are both stale and not very entertaining. I can't stand watching Undertaker's hour long enterance anymore.

Triple H's title reign baffles me too, Orton needed to hold onto it a lot longer than he did. Looks like Triple H got impatient of not having the belt for so long. Well, I'm still happy the belt isn't on Cena.

Why MVP and Kennedy are buried, I have no idea. All I know is they're losing money and potential for two HUGE stars.

As for the titles, your right far too many titles. Miss the days when the IC belt was the second most prestigious belt in the company.

As for Jericho, it's amazing that he takes two years off and still hasn't missed a beat in the ring. Wonderful performer.
Yeah, though I dont really have too much of a problem with Cena his title reign was extremely tedious, unless they turn him heel (which is extremely unlikely I would have thought - due to all the kids merchandise etc..) he should stay well away from the mainevent scene for a good while now.

I'm glad that Matt Hardy went over MVP for the US title, as he had held it for ages, and Hardy deserves a push as he's been mega over ever since the Edge/Lita incidents, and is underated on all fronts imo, whether or not he will ever mainevent is...questionable. Kennedy may be due some sort of push, but as Regal has been suspended he will likely be without a program, and after One Night Stand I imagine HHH will feud with JBL and then Cena, which nobody in their right mind will want to see/care about, yawn.

Regarding the IC title...the last time it was actually defended at a WM was actually...WM18? RVD vs Regal iirc, which shows how much its value has decreased over the years, a shame, as the Jericho/Benoit feud with the IC title 2000-2001 was immense, probably the greatest feud either of them ever had in the WWE. And yeah, Y2J puts a lot of the other guys to shame, he is a model professional, and not only that he is fantasically gifted, mark out for him anyday, and one of the nicest guys in the industry to boot, what a hero.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
Even when Brock Lesnar and Eddie Guerrero were champions, WWE was pretty fun to watch. Whenever there was a Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle match up and you didn't read the spoilers, you honestly wouldn't know who would be going over and they had fantastic matches too. Whilst the late 90's and early 2000's were undoubtedly great there were some great moments too in 2003.
Yeah indeed, I remember there was a Kurt Angle vs Undertaker match on smackdown (which ended in a DQ when brock interfered incidentily) when I genuinely thought it could go either way, and tbh there were serval occasions between 99 and 04 in which I thought that could happen, in fact it was a regular thing. For me the mainevent scene only really began to get predictable after WMXX, when JBL took the WWE title from Eddie I pretty much boycotted the whole thing for a few months, and ever since I started watching again its not been the same. Ironically the feud for a world title that I have enjoyed the most since is probably Y2J vs Cena leading up to Summerslam 05, though again credit to Y2J for making it interesting and carrying Cena, and actually making Cena over with the fans.
 

Majin

International Debutant
Agree that the 3 world championships ruins things, makes the whole thing pointless. The thing that always gets my goat the most though as mentioned is the state of the tag team championship. It wasn't long ago when the Tag Team division was probably my favourite thing in wrestling, when you had like the factions back in the 90's going at it, Nation, DX, Ministry, Corporation etc having sick feuds and then the epic Dudley Boyz/Edge and Christian/Hardys in the first half of 2000's with teams like the A.P.A and that always in the mix as well, was such a ****ing awesome division and generally stole the show most nights. Now it's all just gone to ****e, tag team championship may as well not be there.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
Yeah, generally the tag team division nowadays is used for guys on the roster who otherwise don't have a program, anyone who is half decent who hasnt got a decent feud going is bound to be put together with someone else in a similar position completely out of the blue, and surprise surprise win the titles together in their first match "OMG who would have expected that!?!?!".

Generally that seems to last until one of teh guys in the tea, gets over enough to go back to singles competition, and will either turn on/be turned upon by his partner and feud with them for a month, then enter in a feud with someone higher up on the card and be buried, then show up on ECW a few months later, dire.

For me Tag team titles went downhill from about WM18 when Billy and Chuck retained, lost interest in that about then, mind you the TLC on RAW between Kane, Spike and Bubb Dudley, Y2J & Christian, Jeff Hardy and RVD was pretty damn good, but again it was a load of guys who would normally be singles competitors thrown together to put on a show for one night.

One match that is always forgotten is the TLC that was held on Smackdown for the tag titles and was won by Benoit and Jericho, great match was that.
 

masterblaster

International Captain
Agree that the 3 world championships ruins things, makes the whole thing pointless. The thing that always gets my goat the most though as mentioned is the state of the tag team championship. It wasn't long ago when the Tag Team division was probably my favourite thing in wrestling, when you had like the factions back in the 90's going at it, Nation, DX, Ministry, Corporation etc having sick feuds and then the epic Dudley Boyz/Edge and Christian/Hardys in the first half of 2000's with teams like the A.P.A and that always in the mix as well, was such a ****ing awesome division and generally stole the show most nights. Now it's all just gone to ****e, tag team championship may as well not be there.
It could be a whole lot better though. London and Kendrick are doing nothing, absolutely nothing. Cryme Tyme has some value in being an entertaining comedic tag team, but apart from the odd backstage skit they are doing nothing. Jessie and Festus are also entertaining to an extent.

WWE could also help by coming up with some new and interesting combinations. Team up Elijah Burke and Shelton Benjamin or do something more interesting with Santino and Carlito. They've got plenty of good options but they seem scared of doing anything remotely new and fresh. Re introduce TLC Tag Matches, do something, do anything.

They seem stuck in a rut and seem happy with it. TNA on the other hand has a pretty good Tag Team division. The Dudleys are always good value, LAX is fantastic and Motor City Machine Guns are London and Kendrick amped up by a 100. TNA always produces good bouts with their tag teams.
 

masterblaster

International Captain
My favourite superstar at the moment would have to be AJ Styles. I've always been a mark for AJ, but he was pretty one dimensional in terms of his character. Ever since he's worked with Christian and Kurt Angle he's become the complete performer.

We always knew he was one of the best in the ring, but he's really stepped up his promo work too. Looking forward to this face turn and ofcourse the dream match against Kurt Angle at Slammiversary.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
It could be a whole lot better though. London and Kendrick are doing nothing, absolutely nothing. Cryme Tyme has some value in being an entertaining comedic tag team, but apart from the odd backstage skit they are doing nothing. Jessie and Festus are also entertaining to an extent.

WWE could also help by coming up with some new and interesting combinations. Team up Elijah Burke and Shelton Benjamin or do something more interesting with Santino and Carlito. They've got plenty of good options but they seem scared of doing anything remotely new and fresh. Re introduce TLC Tag Matches, do something, do anything.

They seem stuck in a rut and seem happy with it. TNA on the other hand has a pretty good Tag Team division. The Dudleys are always good value, LAX is fantastic and Motor City Machine Guns are London and Kendrick amped up by a 100. TNA always produces good bouts with their tag teams.
Cryme Tyme should be given some sort of solid program over a course of weeks imo, not only are they entertaining in terms of comedic value, but they are also decent ring workers, both of them could make decent singles competitors one day. London and Kendrick also need a program, instead they spend most of their time being squashed by Umaga, who in turn will go on and job to someone higher up on the card, ala Mark Henry (who for some reason hasnt been laid off by the company).

Elijah Burke is another one who has just fallen away in recent months, after being booked quite well as a Heel he seems to have just disapeared and been without a program of any note for ages now, should get a move to Smackdown imo, would do him and Smackdown a world of good.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
My favourite superstar at the moment would have to be AJ Styles. I've always been a mark for AJ, but he was pretty one dimensional in terms of his character. Ever since he's worked with Christian and Kurt Angle he's become the complete performer.

We always knew he was one of the best in the ring, but he's really stepped up his promo work too. Looking forward to this face turn and ofcourse the dream match against Kurt Angle at Slammiversary.
Yeah I agree, I saw a lot of the angle where Kurt and Tomko had a falling out and Styles had to referee one of their matches, was impressed with his work there, hope he goes over Angle when they face off, imagine he will as well.

I'm not sure who I woudl say my favourite wrestler is at the moment, always mark out for Y2J, just because he is just awesome, and he will always be one of my all time favourites. At the moment I'm enjoying watching Matt Hardy, great that he is now picking up wins in singles competition and has a title to show for it, its also great that he is really over with the fans, barring taker I would say on the last episode of Smackdown I caught he got the biggest pop, props to him, he deserves it.
 

duffer

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Taker...would probs be better used putting over someone else at this stage yes, though again for someone who has spent so much time at the top he hasnt had nearly as many title reigns as other guys in similar positions...so again I can understand that.
Taker actually jobs a lot less than guys like Trips and Shawn. The thing however that makes him different is that he very very rarely ever buries anyone in the way that the two mentioned do.

Taker's gimmick affords him some preotection with regards to losses but the thing he does is make sure the person he feuds with comes out of the feud looking stronger and more credible than they did before the feud. Even though he's winning the feud he's still looking out for the guy he's feuding.

It's a unique gift that only a handful of guys (Rock, Taker and possibly Bret) can do in wrestling and is the reason he gets little to no heat for dominating the upper card and ME feuds that other guys get.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
Taker actually jobs a lot less than guys like Trips and Shawn. The thing however that makes him different is that he very very rarely ever buries anyone in the way that the two mentioned do.

Taker's gimmick affords him some preotection with regards to losses but the thing he does is make sure the person he feuds with comes out of the feud looking stronger and more credible than they did before the feud. Even though he's winning the feud he's still looking out for the guy he's feuding.

It's a unique gift that only a handful of guys (Rock, Taker and possibly Bret) can do in wrestling and is the reason he gets little to no heat for dominating the upper card and ME feuds that other guys get.
yeah, good points. Pretty much why Taker is universally liked by smarts/marks and just fans in general.

I always thought that Kurt Angle was pretty good at this as well tbh, in fact back in 2000 HHH was as well.
 

Barney Rubble

International Coach
Good to be back in the wrestling loop after a month of only sporadically being able to watch. Looking forward to One Night Stand immensely, should surpass last year's event by a long way.

'Taker vs Edge in a TLC Match is bound to be great, it really is. Should and probably will be the main event, and should also be a great blowoff to this top notch feud. I'd expect 'Taker to win, leading to him feuding with either Umaga or MVP over the title, and Edge turning on Vickie and feuding with her and Chavo for a bit.

HHH-Orton will also be awesome, just like their previous LMS encounter. I guess HHH will retain, leading into a couple of filler title matches before we get the big one between HHH and Cena at SummerSlam.

HBK-Batista could be good, but the gimmick match itself is pretty lame. Jeff vs Umaga will probably steal the show, the two have fantastic chemistry and Falls Count Anywhere could produce a real classic with some awesome spots.

The women's 'I Quit' Match is an intriguing one, and Cena-JBL will provide Cena with a chance to flex his brawling muscles. The ECW match should be a bit of fun, if nothing special.

Overall, I think the WWE productd definitely suffered in 2007, but there have been some good PPVs so far this year, and small steps are being taken to get the product back to where it needs to be. ONS could be another rung on the ladder to re-asserting the E's dominance over the floundering TNA.
 

Jono

Virat Kohli (c)
Haven't watched wrestling in two and a half years, but good to see this thread still going strong. :)

Anyway just quickly
I always thought that Kurt Angle was pretty good at this as well tbh, in fact back in 2000 HHH was as well.
Angle was only second to The Rock in this IMO. I mean FFS he made Shane McMahon look like he could be a title contender, such was his ability to put people over, both during promos and especially in the ring.
 

Agent TBY

International Captain
Even when Brock Lesnar and Eddie Guerrero were champions, WWE was pretty fun to watch. Whenever there was a Brock Lesnar vs Kurt Angle match up and you didn't read the spoilers, you honestly wouldn't know who would be going over and they had fantastic matches too. Whilst the late 90's and early 2000's were undoubtedly great there were some great moments too in 2003.
The Smackdown Six era was my favourite period in wrestling. Heyman building the show around some incredible guys with some believable storylines clinched it. That the workrate was off the hook doesn't hurt, either.

I didn't enjoy the Crash TV booking of 99-00 as much as everyone else did, but it was pretty good, no doubt.
 

cricman

International 12th Man
Undertaker @ Damn near 50 shouldn't be Taking Bumps off a ladder that big on to 4 tables, WWE angled it as if it was his last match, I thought I saw a Tear come down Mean Marks eyes. I think he'll be back by september

They Made Batista look like a True Title Contender now after making HBK look so weak and With Jericho forcing the beat down to continue in comical way.

Bad luck for Orton, well see you in a few months, The HHH show continues for another few months :(
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
When was this "taker leaves if he loses" stipulation added? I can only assume that he is injured and will now go away for a few months to recover, and then show up as suggested around september (he damn well better, I ordered my Smackdown ticket to see him dammit!), very surprised that he lost, injured or not tbh, probs to him for taking such huge bumps tbh.

HBK losing is also the correct booking imo, just a shame that it was too Batista and not to Y2J, be interesting to see where that one goes next, and as cricman has said, this has made Batista look like a genuine world title challenger once again (even impressed me tbh, and I have been getting mega sick of him as of late).
 

masterblaster

International Captain
Randy Orton injured with a broken collar bone. That's a real let down because he was getting better and better and for the first time you could tell he felt comfortable with his character. I guess this means we have to endure Triple H vs Cena for the next 6 months. If only WWE would push Ken Kennedy into that slot against Hunter.

Undertaker gone from WWE? He'll be back by Summerslam. Good move this, he was getting really stale. His Deadman character is so limited, can't cut promos, can't interact with the fans. I personally enjoyed his Biker Taker persona much more. Allowed Taker to be himself.
 

masterblaster

International Captain
When was this "taker leaves if he loses" stipulation added? I can only assume that he is injured and will now go away for a few months to recover, and then show up as suggested around september (he damn well better, I ordered my Smackdown ticket to see him dammit!), very surprised that he lost, injured or not tbh, probs to him for taking such huge bumps tbh.

HBK losing is also the correct booking imo, just a shame that it was too Batista and not to Y2J, be interesting to see where that one goes next, and as cricman has said, this has made Batista look like a genuine world title challenger once again (even impressed me tbh, and I have been getting mega sick of him as of late).
The Jericho situation is interesting. The feud with Michaels still could continue, but with the draft coming up I'd love to see him on Smackdown and take on Batista and then Edge. Edge vs Jericho for the World Title would be a dream match up for me.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
The Jericho situation is interesting. The feud with Michaels still could continue, but with the draft coming up I'd love to see him on Smackdown and take on Batista and then Edge. Edge vs Jericho for the World Title would be a dream match up for me.
Would love to see Jericho on Smackdown, would be so awesome to see him live in November, that would probably make my year!

If he gets moved to Smackdown he may actually get some good angles and actually (dare I say it?) a legit challenge for a world title and maybe a run with it, that would be awesome, not only this, but Edge and la familia get so much Heat at the moment he would be the perfect face to go up against them, and is already over so the fans would love it.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
Randy Orton injured with a broken collar bone. That's a real let down because he was getting better and better and for the first time you could tell he felt comfortable with his character. I guess this means we have to endure Triple H vs Cena for the next 6 months. If only WWE would push Ken Kennedy into that slot against Hunter.

Undertaker gone from WWE? He'll be back by Summerslam. Good move this, he was getting really stale. His Deadman character is so limited, can't cut promos, can't interact with the fans. I personally enjoyed his Biker Taker persona much more. Allowed Taker to be himself.
is there any news on how long his injury will keep him out for? as like you say this is a real shame, as he was beginning to do a great job and was looking very credible. Much as it would be good to see Kennedy step up to face off against HHH it looks unlikely, esspecially with Cena owning JBL last night.

I like both Undertaker personas personally, but I do miss his promos as the american badass, its kind of ironic that a guy like him who has some of the best mic skills in the company rarely gets to use them, but yet guys who have poor mic skills are put on the back burner because they can't cut a promo.
 
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