Rate the captains

[Perm]

From what I've read, Martin Crowe was a pretty good captain. Whether or not that was based purely on the 1992 World Cup I'm not sure.

 

[Zinzan]

Gotta love the way Fleming gets 4 votes before most people get 1... and at least 3 from young Kiwis too.

Don't know why you ask people to vote and then rubbish there opinion. Fleming could easily be considered the greatest ever when you consider the resources he has had over the years. Imagine if Fleming had captained Australia from 1997-2007. Certainly if there was a vote of which captain got the most out of limited resources it would be Fleming hands-down

 

[biased indian]

imran for me..
just look the pakistan results during him and others time should be better i think...
and he had a command and respect over his players may be only miandad may not agree

 

[Briony]

Don't know why you ask people to vote and then rubbish there opinion. Fleming could easily be considered the greatest ever when you consider the resources he has had over the years. Imagine if Fleming had captained Australia from 1997-2007. Certainly if there was a vote of which captain got the most out of limited resources it would be Fleming hands-down

But in ODIs for eg., he's still on the wrong side of the win/loss ledger. How is this value adding? Surely a captain to be considered great could have won more than he lost? He commanded many of the world's best one day players in his time as well.

 

[Richard]

Don't know why you ask people to vote and then rubbish there opinion. Fleming could easily be considered the greatest ever when you consider the resources he has had over the years. Imagine if Fleming had captained Australia from 1997-2007. Certainly if there was a vote of which captain got the most out of limited resources it would be Fleming hands-down

FFS... "rubbish their opinion". I've done absolutely nothing of the sort - I specifically said I don't think the notion of Fleming as the best captain ever is a completely outrageous one, much as I'd not consider it myself.

I just find it kinda funny that Fleming is leading the poll as TBH I wasn't really expecting it. And the fact that it's Kiwis of approximately my age almost without fail who've voted for him is doubly amusing.

 

[CrazY GirL]

Imran Khan anyday

 

[subshakerz]

All very fine captains, but I would go for Imran Khan:

-For uniting the most fractitious side in cricket

-For completely changing the attitude of Pakistani cricket from the defensive mindset in the 70s to the attacking brand of cricket associated with Pakistan since

-For personally grooming the next generation of superstars (Waqar, Wasim, Mushtaq Ahmed) and showing faith in others when selectors did not (Abdul Qadir, Inzamam)

-For becoming the first captain to push for and instate neutral umpires (and this was in a home series)

-For inspiring his side to match the greatest team of his era, the West Indies, in three consequtive series

-For leading from the front with both bat and ball more than any other cricketer in history (he averaged over 50 with the bat and 20 with the ball as captain)

 

[Engle]

Mark Taylor ,the reason why Aussies became invincibles, in my opinion . Then the older ones ,i don't remember that much .So from those i watched .

I am taken aback by the support for Mark Taylor. Some of it may be true.
However, it was Alan Border with his intense fighting spirit who raised an Aussie team from the depths of despair (Packer) to the pinnacle of glory with an upset WC victory and subsequent resurgence. MTaylor was handed on a silver platter a very good team combined with the good luck of a general deterioration of top-notch opposition.

 

[Engle]

All very fine captains, but I would go for Imran Khan:

-For uniting the most fractitious side in cricket

-For completely changing the attitude of Pakistani cricket from the defensive mindset in the 70s to the attacking brand of cricket associated with Pakistan since

-For personally grooming the next generation of superstars (Waqar, Wasim, Mushtaq Ahmed) and showing faith in others when selectors did not (Abdul Qadir, Inzamam)

-For becoming the first captain to push for and instate neutral umpires (and this was in a home series)

-For inspiring his side to match the greatest team of his era, the West Indies, in three consequtive series

-For leading from the front with both bat and ball more than any other cricketer in history (he averaged over 50 with the bat and 20 with the ball as captain)

Bang on. To that I would add :

- For bringing an end to favouritism/past-performance mindset inherent in team selection. He dropped his cousin and hero Majid, for the sake of the team, clearly signalling a fairness policy of selecting only the best players regardless.

- For superior marketing and media management, part of a captains responsibility.

- For disallowing the pursuit of individual stats over team goals

 

[archie mac]

The Voice of Australian Cricket wrote a book about the best Test captains, he thought Chappelli the best, and from what I have read I think that is still the case, although as others have written it is not easy to rate captains.

Archie MaLaren is a strange one, some think him a shocker others think him the best ever, including Fred Tate

I must say I would have liked to see a few of the best captains results wise on the list

 

[Richard]

I am taken aback by the support for Mark Taylor. Some of it may be true.
However, it was Alan Border with his intense fighting spirit who raised an Aussie team from the depths of despair (Packer) to the pinnacle of glory with an upset WC victory and subsequent resurgence. MTaylor was handed on a silver platter a very good team combined with the good luck of a general deterioration of top-notch opposition.

That's all very true, but near enough everyone I've read tends to rate Taylor as a superior tactician to Border. Both were unquestionably superb at getting the best from players.

Unquestionably, Australia made more progress under Border than Taylor. But as I've said so many times, results aren't neccessarily the most important means of judging a captain.

 

[Richard]

The Voice of Australian Cricket wrote a book about the best Test captains, he thought Chappelli the best, and from what I have read I think that is still the case, although as others have written it is not easy to rate captains.

So Benaud thought I Chappell a better captain than himself? Interesting. Modest though he may be, he's never been one to let modesty get in the way of his skills of judgement.

Archie MaLaren is a strange one, some think him a shocker others think him the best ever, including Fred Tate

Sean, I am so disappointed in you, I felt sure you were going to put one vote in the column of the man who forms your posting-ID.

Mind, his dissent on the Mold issue has always counted against him for me - other than that, the (compared to you, very little) I've read about him all paints him as the best captain of his time, easily.

 

[funnygirl]

All very fine captains, but I would go for Imran Khan:

-For uniting the most fractitious side in cricket

-For completely changing the attitude of Pakistani cricket from the defensive mindset in the 70s to the attacking brand of cricket associated with Pakistan since

-For personally grooming the next generation of superstars (Waqar, Wasim, Mushtaq Ahmed) and showing faith in others when selectors did not (Abdul Qadir, Inzamam)

-For becoming the first captain to push for and instate neutral umpires (and this was in a home series)

-For inspiring his side to match the greatest team of his era, the West Indies, in three consequtive series

-For leading from the front with both bat and ball more than any other cricketer in history (he averaged over 50 with the bat and 20 with the ball as captain)

He has every right to be called as the greatest modern day captain .However along with all those capabilities and attitudes ,he brought a lot of politics as well ,he showed sort of personal favouritism ,an autcratic approach like ''if some one says some thing against me they are out forever ''. May be thats the way Pakistan cricket is working .Plus there was a huge factor to his successes ,a rather underrated one .Javed Miandad ,he was the brain behind many strategic decisions ,field placements etc .For all his tantrums ,he was so cooperative as a vice captain which even Imran would agree and contributed in a big way ,than just a vice captain .

 

[roseboy64]

Poll's flawed. Names missing. Don't know how you can leave out Waugh, Richards and Lloyd. I'm sure other names could be in too.

 

[Richard]

Because I don't think any of them were especially good captains, merely leaders of good teams. Richards more so than ever, in fact.

 

[roseboy64]

Others might disagree with you and aren't you trying to get the opinions of others? Poll shouldn't be about what you think then.

 

[Richard]

I started the thread and I posted a poll that I thought would get the most interesting discussion.

I don't think "Stephen Waugh is the greatest captain ever because he led and others followed and Australia won X Tests under him" is remotely interesting, I've heard it 50 times before, and I'll always think it complete nonsense.

So I posted a poll that I thought would encourage the least amount of that possible.

I'm interested in hearing the opinions of others on those I posted - not Stephen Waugh, or Clive Lloyd.

 

[Zinzan]

But in ODIs for eg., he's still on the wrong side of the win/loss ledger. How is this value adding? Surely a captain to be considered great could have won more than he lost? He commanded many of the world's best one day players in his time as well.

By that theory only Captain's of top sides would be considered.

Who are the "many of the worlds best players" your referring to?

Apart from 2 world beaters in Bond & Cairns (both hampered SO much by injury its not funny) and 2 very good players (but not world beaters in Flemings time) in Vettori and Astle who are the many of the worlds best players your referring to?

Remember he captained for 10 years - The NZ ODI side has only had a better win/loss ratio since around 2004. Before then Fleming captained some incredibly weak sides yet still pulled off many unlikely victories often purely through strategy, field placements, temperament and patience.

 

[Flem274*]

By that theory only Captain's of top sides would be considered.

Who are the "many of the worlds best players" your referring to?

Apart from 2 world beaters in Bond & Cairns (both hampered SO much by injury its not funny) and 2 very good players (but not world beaters in Flemings time) in Vettori and Astle who are the many of the worlds best players your referring to?

Remember he captained for 10 years - The NZ ODI side has only had a better win/loss ratio since around 2004. Before then Fleming captained some incredibly weak sides yet still pulled off many unlikely victories often purely through strategy, field placements, temperament and patience.

Twose and Allot in their prime were right up there. Good old Chris Harris as well. Perhaps Taylor but he didn't captain him much. Styris would roughly equal Astle. They're the only ones I can think of that she might be reffering to.

 

[roseboy64]

I started the thread and I posted a poll that I thought would get the most interesting discussion.

I don't think "Stephen Waugh is the greatest captain ever because he led and others followed and Australia won X Tests under him" is remotely interesting, I've heard it 50 times before, and I'll always think it complete nonsense.

So I posted a poll that I thought would encourage the least amount of that possible.

I'm interested in hearing the opinions of others on those I posted - not Stephen Waugh, or Clive Lloyd.

Not credible enough. Won't dignify the poll with a vote.