***Official*** South Africa in India

[Cevno]

Stopped reading after the first one, given the fact that the scorecard suggested the pitch was flatter than Calista Flockhart...

I knew that scorecard made the pitch look flat but deliberately included it.
I watched that game and on the first day the ball was swinging and the pitch was pretty lively.If it wasn't for him the indians would have got out for 200 or therabouts and that would have put pressure on him.
Later on the pitch got flatter.
Btw,what about the other knocks?

 

[Cevno]

Not exactly sure what you're trying to prove with those links, all bar 1 have the team India were facing scoring at least 500 runs or near enough to it in one of their innings, which would suggest the Indian lineup bar Sehwag just failed miserably. The conditions can't exactly have been bad in any of them considering the amount of runs scored

What exactly you mean by bad conditions?
I have seen most of the games and the pitches were by no means flat.And add to this the crumbling batting line up.
The other team most of the time managed to score so many runs due to crap bowling by the indian team.
If you are talking about matches in which average score was about 250 then his 60-70 become valuable there which i have not counted.

 

[Prince EWS]

Btw,what about the other knocks?

Do you not understand the meaning of "stopped reading after", or something?

 

[Cevno]

Do you not understand the meaning of "stopped reading after", or something?

So you will not change your views, no matter what and are not even willing to consider any propositions..
Wonder what your views are about hayden then?

I am not saying that sehwag has scored in really tough conditions as say dravid has but to say that he has just scored in absolutely flat conditions is bit off the mark.

 

[TT Boy]

I knew that scorecard made the pitch look flat but deliberately included it.
I watched that game and on the first day the ball was swinging and the pitch was pretty lively.If it wasn't for him the indians would have got out for 200 or therabouts and that would have put pressure on him.
Later on the pitch got flatter.
Btw,what about the other knocks?

In one of them Human nearly scored a run a ball ton, nuff said.

But regardless of that and the clamour of Sehwag being a flat track bully this knock today was awesome. I mean a couple of the South Africans illustrated how easy the wicket was but Sehwag went at quicker than a run a ball nigh on all day (and offered no chances) whilst his partner Dravid at times could not get the ball of the square. That’s some indication of the quality of the innings.

 

[Prince EWS]

So you will not change your views, no matter what and are not even willing to consider any propositions..

I never said that. I was merely pointing out that I dismissed your post as rubbish once I read that first scorecard.

Wonder what your views are about hayden then?

Haha, you'd be surprised.

 

[ret]

I can't understand why some ppl would be so much against Sehwag

I believe that he is someone who is showing that bookish technique is over-rated and thus shaking the faith of those who believe absolutely in bookish technique

I don't think that Sehwag scores on flat wkts is a point coz there are 21 other guys who are playing on that pitch but we never see the kind of impact that Sehwag makes .... Many folks have done that down the history but that never comes up on their minds .... and somehow ppl chose overlook his 100 in Melbourne

Even in Ind there is always a talk of about the big 4, but two of the big 4, i.e. Laxman and Ganguly don't even average 50 plus and they mostly look to bat down the order .... while Sehwag not only avg more and has scored around the same 100s as them in significantly less games but also while opening the batting

 

[Raghav]

I can't understand why some ppl would be so much against Sehwag

I believe that he is someone who is showing that bookish technique is over-rated and thus shaking the faith of those who believe absolutely in bookish technique

I don't think that Sehwag scores on flat wkts is a point coz there are 21 other guys who are playing on that pitch but we never see the kind of impact that Sehwag makes .... And ppl have done that down the history but that never comes up and somehow ppl overlook his 100s in Melbourne

Even in Ind there is always a talk of about the big 4, but two of the big 4, i.e. Laxman and Ganguly don't even average 50 plus and they mostly look to bat down the order .... while Sehwag not only avg more and has scored around the same 100s as them in significantly less games but also while opening the batting

Not really. Today's inngs will answer everything

 

[TT Boy]

I can't understand why some ppl would be so much against Sehwag

I believe that he is someone who is showing that bookish technique is over-rated and thus shaking the faith of those who believe absolutely in bookish technique
I don't think that Sehwag scores on flat wkts is a point coz there are 21 other guys who are playing on that pitch but we never see the kind of impact that Sehwag makes .... Many folks have done that down the history but that never comes up on their minds .... and somehow ppl chose overlook his 100 in Melbourne

Even in Ind there is always a talk of about the big 4, but two of the big 4, i.e. Laxman and Ganguly don't even average 50 plus and they mostly look to bat down the order .... while Sehwag not only avg more and has scored around the same 100s as them in significantly less games but also while opening the batting

Well it’s overrated when the ball is doing nothing but his limited technique only eighteen months ago in South Africa caused practically everyone to suggest this guy should be gone after he was routinely owned.

But I think you just have to accept that with Sehwag for when he comes across wickets with not a lot of life, there isn’t much better around.

 

[silentstriker]

I can't understand why some ppl would be so much against Sehwag

I believe that he is someone who is showing that bookish technique is over-rated and thus shaking the faith of those who believe absolutely in bookish technique

No it isn't. To be a quality batsmen in all conditions and against all bowling, a bookish technique is immensely helpful. As many have showed, you don't become a good player just by possessing it, or that you can't be a good player if you don't possess it, but it certainly helps. The 'see ball, hit ball' technique is fine for certain pitches and certain eras, but aside from being quite ugly, is limited with only a few people being the exception.

 

[Prince EWS]

Haha, just looked through Cevno's links.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63998.html
I didn't see the game. However, there were only 3 innings in it, one of which saw 617 compiled.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63951.html
Again I didn't see the game, but with first innings totals of 379 and 563, I reckon the pitch was pretty flat. I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt on it though.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64061.html
Saw that game, flat as a tac. Bowling attack was also dire. This is a perfect example of what I was talking about.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64100.html
Saw the game, good innings. The pitch wasn't flat as such but it was offering ZERO assistance for the fast bowlers, which is my point in regards to Sehwag.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64127.html
You're kidding, right? Scores of 570 and 499 in the first innings, including a partnership of over 300. What exactly are you trying to prove? I'm quite aware he's scored runs.. you were supposed to provide examples of times where he scored them on tracks that weren't flat. The post is looking more biased with each scorecard really.

http://content-aus.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/332911.html
You're kidding, right? That's the current game!! The pitch is ridiculously flat, FFS. Even you should be able to see that.

 

[sideshowtim]

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63998.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63951.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64061.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64100.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64127.html
http://stats.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/332911.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64082.html

All these knocks by sehwag were not exactly flat tracks.Just see the contribution in terms of how the other's have performed with respect to him in the team.

Lol, congratulations on completely self-destructing your argument.

 

[Cevno]

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63998.html
I didn't see the game. However, there were only 3 innings in it, one of which saw 617 compiled.

You have to realise that in a test match the pitch changes course over a period of time.I have detailed before.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63951.html
Again I didn't see the game, but with first innings totals of 379 and 563, I reckon the pitch was pretty flat. I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt on it though.

Just look at the other scores in comparison.
The pitch was offering good movement.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64061.html
Saw that game, flat as a tac. Bowling attack was also dire. This is a perfect example of what I was talking about.

195 out of 366.How flat could the track be?
The indian attack made the track look flat.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64100.html
Saw the game, good innings. The pitch wasn't flat as such but it was offering ZERO assistance for the fast bowlers, which is my point in regards to Sehwag.

Now you have changed atleast from he does not score in non-flat tracks to he does not score on non-flat pace assisting spin non assisting tracks.





http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64127.html
You're kidding, right? Scores of 570 and 499 in the first innings, including a partnership of over 300. What exactly are you trying to prove? I'm quite aware he's scored runs.. you were supposed to provide examples of times where he scored them on tracks that weren't flat. The post is looking more biased with each scorecard really.[/QUOTE]

201 out of 499 with the second highest being 78.

You're kidding, right? That's the current game!! The pitch is ridiculously flat, FFS. Even you should be able to see that.

Sorry my fault.

I meant to post another link.

 

[paddy11]

Oh man, can't wait to see Sachin and Dhoni batting on this.

Sehwag not good enough for you :P

 

[Majin]

What exactly you mean by bad conditions?
I have seen most of the games and the pitches were by no means flat.And add to this the crumbling batting line up.
The other team most of the time managed to score so many runs due to crap bowling by the indian team.
If you are talking about matches in which average score was about 250 then his 60-70 become valuable there which i have not counted.

It doesn't matter, all that matters is that the pitch was good enough that teams were able to pile up massive scores in almost all of those games. So they might not be completely dead, but we're not exactly talking about early to mid 90's Sabina park here either. Besides, I'm not trying to say Sehwag is or isn't anything, I'm just saying the games you've linked are clearly not games where batting was incredibly difficult

Anyway, currently watching the highlights of this game and loving it so much. Don't care how flat the pitch is, the shots Sehwag are playing are bloody incredible. It's an amazing knock, I love it Love how many signs in the crowd say "get another 309!" or "we want a triple viru", it's awesome

 

[ret]

Well it’s overrated when the ball is doing nothing but his limited technique only eighteen months ago in South Africa caused practically everyone to suggest this guy should be gone after he was routinely owned.

But I think you just have to accept that with Sehwag for when he comes across wickets with not a lot of life, there isn’t much better around.

I think Sehwag was going through a bad phase then so it didn't matter what he did .... Others with perceived gr8 technique didn't do that well either on that series

take his 195 at Melbourne, where conditions assisted bowlers, for e.g .... many with perceived better technique failed

on the NZ tour before the WC03, entire team did badly on the green turfs presented during that series .... so nothing suggested that bookish technique is not over-rated

 

[ret]

It would be interesting to see who are the batsmen perceived to be doing well in bowler friendly conditions and then what percentage of their 100s have been on such pitches to determine that they are not flat pitch bullies

 

[Ikki]

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63998.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/63951.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64061.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64100.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64127.html
http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/statsguru/engine/match/64082.html

All these knocks by sehwag were not exactly flat tracks.Just see the contribution in terms of how the other's have performed with respect to him in the team.

Hmm, not sure what you're trying to prove there. It actually paints Sehwag very badly.

I am doing the same kinda analysis with Hayden. Looking at his scores of 100+, it's actually quite funny how regularly he is the only person to score a 100 in either his team or the opposition and how often maybe one other batsmen from his side scores a century or one from the opposition - as there doesn't appear to be many where one from his side AND the opposition also scored a century. Gonna search more.

 

[JBH001]

Great innings by Sehwag (shame I cant get to see it on TV here in NZ - although there will probably be a youtube compilation pretty soon). But I do have to concur that many of Sehwags massive knocks have come in conducive conditions and/or against poor or talented but rookie attacks.

A couple of years ago, I was assessing Anwar vs Sehwag (I think it was in a discussion with SS) and I went through all his hundreds and found that a good many of them were not as good as they might seem (if context is taken into account). I think, iirc, there was one hundred against a good SA attack early in his career, but that was at no.6. The rest have been much of a muchness (although his 100 in Adelaide and in India, 04?, were, admittedly, very good ones).

Still over-rated for mine, as the true test of a consistently good opening batsman is when conditions suit the bowler (seam and/or swing).

But perhaps this signals the start of a new phase for him? One can only hope so.

 

[Nutter]

A real talent, Sehwag. Imagine if he developed Dravid's defensive technique? He'd be unstoppable.