Flem274*
123/5
Yeah we should probably consider a three team domestic comp to create tougher competition. I can't see us get anymore tests until we get better at it so its a catch 22 (I think thats the word anyways)
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***Official*** New Zealand in South Africa
- Thread starter James
- Start date
Fiery
Banned
Thank you pup
How have you been bud?
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Has the board ever considered trying to get New Zealand A admitted to the Pura Cup?
Flem274*
123/5
Not sure. Its a good idea.
Julian87
State Captain
In a team where decent batters are hard to come by, it is just stupid that Sinclair is not in the team. his record shows he is the best number three in the country. I know Fulton has played there, but he looks better suited to 4 or 5 IMO. I have never really rated Styris and I think he is just a stop gap ATM, holding blokes like Broom and Nicol back.
I think a major problem ATM is there are too many lower order players. McCullum, Oram, Vettori, Franklin and Mills could all bat at least number 8 IMO, but they're all a bit bits and pieces. And to include all of them in a test match you need 2 of them to bat as high as 6 and 7 which I don't really think Oram and McCullum are up to ATM. Once Fulton is back, the batting will sure up IMO and hopefully the upcoming matches against lesser teams will kick start taylor's career because IMO, he is good enough at 5 or 6 and NZ really need him to stand up.
But THE PROBLEM is obviously opening batting. Papps and Cumming aren't good enough. there are no other openers better than them and moving up a middle order player can potentially ruin careers. I think Vincent has to be there, but who should parter him, I just don't know. I'd say Sinclair but apparently there is a reluctance to open there. It is a very large problem IMO.
PS: Can any NZer's tell me if a young batsman named Chris Bartolomeusz from Canterbury has come through the ranks or not? I have played aginst him quite a few times and he always struck me as being a class above everyone else I saw at his level when I was over there.
I think a major problem ATM is there are too many lower order players. McCullum, Oram, Vettori, Franklin and Mills could all bat at least number 8 IMO, but they're all a bit bits and pieces. And to include all of them in a test match you need 2 of them to bat as high as 6 and 7 which I don't really think Oram and McCullum are up to ATM. Once Fulton is back, the batting will sure up IMO and hopefully the upcoming matches against lesser teams will kick start taylor's career because IMO, he is good enough at 5 or 6 and NZ really need him to stand up.
But THE PROBLEM is obviously opening batting. Papps and Cumming aren't good enough. there are no other openers better than them and moving up a middle order player can potentially ruin careers. I think Vincent has to be there, but who should parter him, I just don't know. I'd say Sinclair but apparently there is a reluctance to open there. It is a very large problem IMO.
PS: Can any NZer's tell me if a young batsman named Chris Bartolomeusz from Canterbury has come through the ranks or not? I have played aginst him quite a few times and he always struck me as being a class above everyone else I saw at his level when I was over there.
NZTailender
I can't believe I ate the whole thing
I hate to agree with you, but it does feel like Styris is holding a spot in the side for a player like Broom or Nicol. As much as I like adn rate Styris, I'll be glad when he does step aside/get dropped because then we'll see better batsmen come through and be at their rightful place. He also still strikes me as a bit of a bits and pieces all rounder who would do Orams job at 6 better than Oram.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Yes...but the problem is that we don't really know whether guys like Broom and Nicol are in fact better than the likes of Styris, until they step up to the highest level. They could be completely exposed, like Papps has been over the last month. For me, unless a player has a truly exceptional record in New Zealand domestic cricket (like Ryder and Fulton in FC, Taylor in list A), there really is no way of telling. Even then, one can't be certain, given how low the standard of both players and pitches are in New Zealand domestic cricket. Still, perhaps Styris could do with a bit of time to shore up his technique in the international game, he's been pretty hopeless for a while now.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
They average in the high 30's which isn't bad. But the standard of bowling on the New Zealand domestic circuit is so far below international standards, its hard to draw any useful conclusions from that.
NUFAN
Y no Afghanistan flag
NZ Test Cricket ****s me to tears at the moment.
Craig Cumming is absolutely rubbish. I can't fathom why they think a dude who is never going to average more then 28 is good enough for the side.
At least with Vincent and Sinclair you know they have potential to pull off some gun innings. Same applies with Hamish Marshall aswell.
Craig Cumming is absolutely rubbish. I can't fathom why they think a dude who is never going to average more then 28 is good enough for the side.
At least with Vincent and Sinclair you know they have potential to pull off some gun innings. Same applies with Hamish Marshall aswell.
Fiery
Banned
And Papps is even worse!
NZTailender
I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Papps has age and talent on his side IMO. Cumming has the ability but will only be a stop gap solution for us until another opener bashes the door down.
NZTailender
I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Would love to see
1. Papps
2. Cumming
3. Sinclair
4. Vincent
5. Fleming
6. Taylor
7. McCullum
8. Franklin
9. Vettori
10. Mills
11. Bond
versus Bangladesh.
1. Papps
2. Cumming
3. Sinclair
4. Vincent
5. Fleming
6. Taylor
7. McCullum
8. Franklin
9. Vettori
10. Mills
11. Bond
versus Bangladesh.
Fiery
Banned
Very debatable. Papps has been so bad on this current tour it's almost like Ken Rutherford in the Windies in 1985. At least Cumming has had one good knock. I would pick Cumming over Papps for Bangladesh myself, if by some miracle another opener puts his hand up
Last edited:
slugger
State Vice-Captain
thats a great spot for fleming to see out his career isnt that where most skipper x skippers play their final inn. s waugh, a border im sure there are others Arjuna Ranatunga?
Matt52
U19 Vice-Captain
Fulton will be back by then wont he...
Natman20
International Debutant
You would think looking at the batting line-up Papps, cumming and Taylor are all maybes in South Africa. The selectors should have been able to realise the stability of experience and current form in domestic cricket which is needed in the New Zealand line-up especially without the likes of Astle. The batting is very un-balanced and fair enough for trying it out but seriously surely they would pick consistency in domestic cricket rather than hopeful players like Taylor who are not cosistently in the runs yet. And what do they do, they send How over to stabilise the top order. Again thats testing the un-tested and yes he is a good player but just like most New Zealand batsman he has failed to capitalise on the opportunities given so far. Sometimes I wonder about these selectors and their rationale.
It will be good to see Mills back in the squad although it would have been better to see him in the ODIs. Who knows he might spark something but that is quite unlikely.
Thats the bad stuff. The good stuff ... Vettori looks very good with the bat this tour. Two very good scores in the first-class matches and a decent 46* I think he should boost himself up to come in near the top of the order. He looks the most stable out of any batsman in our squad so far and I think he is coming in at the wrong time of the innings when nearly all is lost.
The bowling side of things ... What to say. Bond is gone and we are left with a few bits and bobbs to do the job and I think the second innings of the last test highlighted how we may sruggle to be able to claim those 20 wickets in an innings. Whether or not we were bowling well or the conditions suited bowling at the beginning of the last match may yet to be seen in the next game.
It will be good to see Mills back in the squad although it would have been better to see him in the ODIs. Who knows he might spark something but that is quite unlikely.
Thats the bad stuff. The good stuff ... Vettori looks very good with the bat this tour. Two very good scores in the first-class matches and a decent 46* I think he should boost himself up to come in near the top of the order. He looks the most stable out of any batsman in our squad so far and I think he is coming in at the wrong time of the innings when nearly all is lost.
The bowling side of things ... What to say. Bond is gone and we are left with a few bits and bobbs to do the job and I think the second innings of the last test highlighted how we may sruggle to be able to claim those 20 wickets in an innings. Whether or not we were bowling well or the conditions suited bowling at the beginning of the last match may yet to be seen in the next game.