The greatest-ever left-arm finger-spinner

[neville cardus]

Thanks for the info Neville. I never knew that about Blythe.

Pleasure. You should give this a read:

http://www.cricketweb.net/content/bookreview.php?NewsIDAuto=2283

(Btw, I voted for Verity)

Good choice. Having read a rare piece of writing by him just prior to posting this thread, I was tempted to do so, too.

 

[Athlai]

Good choice. Having read a rare piece of writing by him just prior to posting this thread, I was tempted to do so, too.

"I really am probably the best left arm finger spinner ever, I'm quite serious." p4 Verity

 

[Lillian Thomson]

"I really am probably the best left arm finger spinner ever, I'm quite serious." p4 Verity

But when he said that Norman Gifford was still in nappies.

 

[anoop4real]

Vettori the man!!!!

 

[Richard]

But when he said that Norman Gifford was still in nappies.

Norman "I was barred by Del and Philippe-Henri because they were both infinitely better than me" Gifford?

 

[neville cardus]

Here's an annoyingly understated W.G. on Peate, from my copy of Cricket:

"[By 1882] Peate, of Yorkshire, had [...] become the acknowledged best slow bowler of England [....]" -- p. 168

"The state of the wicket has much to do with the amount of break to be obtained. When it is dry and hard you must be content with very little indeed; but after heavy rains, with a strong sun drying it, you may be able to perform wonders. A. G. Steel and Spofforth amongst the amateurs, Peate, Alfred Shaw and J. C. Shaw amongst the professionals, used to perform great things then, the amount of curl they got on being simply astonishing." -- p. 247

And here's a link to some fascinating information gleaned from a kind White Rose poster:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/274761/thread/1194176272/last-1194218217/Peate+for+"Peate"

 

[Richard]

"As soon as Ted was dismissed"? Does this mean he was fired after 214 wickets in 1882, 120 in 1883, 137 in 1884 and 115 in 1885???????!!!!!!!!!!

 

[neville cardus]

"As soon as Ted was dismissed"? Does this mean he was fired after 214 wickets in 1882, 120 in 1883, 137 in 1884 and 115 in 1885???????!!!!!!!!!!

Yep. His sacking was on much the same grounds as Bobby Peel's. Crapulence never sat well with Lord Hawke.

 

[Richard]

I regret to inform you I'm unfamiliar with Peel's sacking's circumstances too. As I said, about the only thing I know about him is the Hawke sending-off incident.

(They weren't connected were they? )

 

[neville cardus]

I regret to inform you I'm unfamiliar with Peel's sacking's circumstances too. As I said, about the only thing I know about him is the Hawke sending-off incident.
(They weren't connected were they? )

They were. As Bobby himself so adorably put it in recalling the incident (if you'll excuse the liberties I've taken with the Yorkshire dialect), "Lud 'Awke pur 'is ahm aroun' me 'n' 'elped me off t'groun' -- 'n' ou' o' firs'-class crikkit! Wharra gentleman!"

 

[Richard]

So both were sacked for drunkenness?

If so, it was Rhodes then who broke the vicious part of the line?

 

[neville cardus]

So both were sacked for drunkenness?

Yep, and they weren't the only ones. I spotted this on an old genealogy group: "Another Yorkshire cricketer that I'm more certain I'm related to, is Edward/Ted Hawden of Hunslet, who played just once for the county in 1889 at the age of 27. He scored 66 runs, and the family story is that he overdid his celebrations to such an extent that he was never picked again."

If so, it was Rhodes then who broke the vicious part of the line?

I don't quite follow you.

 

[ChipSomeSixes]

Iqbal Qasim

 

[Richard]

I don't quite follow you.

In being a brilliant left-arm fingerspinner who didn't get sacked for drunkenness.

 

[Richard]

Iqbal Qasim

I was gonna say

then I remembered.

 

[neville cardus]

Iqbal Qasim

Have you even heard of all the others on that list?

 

[neville cardus]

In being a brilliant left-arm fingerspinner who didn't get sacked for drunkenness.

Wilfred and Emmott were great characters and certainly not averse to the odd down-down, but, yes: that'd be correct.

Lord Hawke was an arrogant, self-deceiving, pompous, autocratic and utterly detestable little turd. His autobiography is replete with such sanctimonious B.S. as "I believe I have done more than anyone else to raise the standard and self-respect of the splendid paid section of first-class cricketers" and "the mark system [...] was entirely my own idea [....] I gave marks according to my view of the importance to the side of what was done. Not only did I reward good batting and really excellent bowling [...] but I also allocated marks for fine wicketkeeping and smart fielding."

 

[neville cardus]

Yep, and they weren't the only ones. I spotted this on an old genealogy group: "Another Yorkshire cricketer that I'm more certain I'm related to, is Edward/Ted Hawden of Hunslet, who played just once for the county in 1889 at the age of 27. He scored 66 runs, and the family story is that he overdid his celebrations to such an extent that he was never picked again."

Joseph Preston also had a drinking problem, although whether or not he was fired for it I don't know. Alcoholism was certainly a huge problem throughout the county's early years. Louis Hall, who debuted eleven years after it won first-class status, was the first teetotaller.

 

[neville cardus]

In a bid to get the contemporaries' views on the matter, I've done a spot of research and found that Billy Murdoch thought Peate comfortably the best; Arthur Shrewsbury found Peel more difficult than Peate; Blythe was placed ahead of Rhodes by Ranji, Jessop, Hirst, Warner and Rhodes himself; old Yorkshiremen who saw them all from Peate to Verity went for Peate; while most who saw Ikey Hodgson dubbed him the greatest.

What make we of all this?

 

[Richard]

As I said - would be happy to believe Peate the best, but if he was he couldn't have been that much better than Rhodes.

And Rhodes is very possibly the greatest legend in Yorkshire history. Almost one of an exclusive club in that you pretty much never hear a bad word about him in the clubhouse.