Hope you are totally wrong lol I hope he hangs on till CB series
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***Official*** England in Sri Lanka
- Thread starter JASON
- Start date
gettingbetter
State Vice-Captain
gettingbetter
State Vice-Captain
McGrath
Gillespie
S. Waugh
Langer
Its not about misfortune anyway. Its about being realistic - how long have these questions been asked?
Theres your answer.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Almost all these cases are recent ones - happily, the stupid pension-them-off crap seems to have taken a back-seat - hopefully it might be for good (though I won't hold my breath).
Nonetheless, there've been calls for pretty much all of said cases (though I'm not sure where Stephen Waugh had a long break at all?) to be pensioned-off old-style, with the possible exception of McGrath who was welcomed back with open arms in 2004 because of the utter terribleness of the attack in his absence.
Thankfully, said calls were resisted and all 3 players justified the faith shown in them.
And it doesn't matter how long the questions have been asked, either - someone can be out of the game for 4 years as far as I'm concerned - if they wish to and deserve to come back in, they damn well should.
Nonetheless, there've been calls for pretty much all of said cases (though I'm not sure where Stephen Waugh had a long break at all?) to be pensioned-off old-style, with the possible exception of McGrath who was welcomed back with open arms in 2004 because of the utter terribleness of the attack in his absence.
Thankfully, said calls were resisted and all 3 players justified the faith shown in them.
And it doesn't matter how long the questions have been asked, either - someone can be out of the game for 4 years as far as I'm concerned - if they wish to and deserve to come back in, they damn well should.
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gettingbetter
State Vice-Captain
R e Waugh, collision with Gillespie - can't rember how long he was out for.
I can't believe someone like you is still slightly optimistic that these two will come back. Jones in particular.
I can't believe someone like you is still slightly optimistic that these two will come back. Jones in particular.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
I'm not optimistic Jones will come back, haven't been for a little while. But he deserves the chance to, not "ah well, we've got Plunkett and Mahmood now!"
Waugh was out for all of half a Test, BTW, in his collision with Gillespie, and still in the prime of his career. It was Gillespie who was out for ages.
Waugh was out for all of half a Test, BTW, in his collision with Gillespie, and still in the prime of his career. It was Gillespie who was out for ages.
gettingbetter
State Vice-Captain
Ok.
Either way, we've just missed the 2nd year anniversary of Simon Jones' last Test. And my responses to the question on whether Jones will come back is in relation to this. Through my eyes, the question is tedious.
Either way, we've just missed the 2nd year anniversary of Simon Jones' last Test. And my responses to the question on whether Jones will come back is in relation to this. Through my eyes, the question is tedious.
TT Boy
Hall of Fame Member
Murtaza Hussain, England's second spinner? 
http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/countycricket2007/content/current/player/41314.html
http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/countycricket2007/content/current/player/41314.html
aussie
Hall of Fame Member
Ha its going to very interesting to see who England pick as their keepers this winter. If Prior has a bad 20/20 WC he could be on his way out.
Looking at the county circuit i think just like how England have resorted to split captains in test & ODI's i think that may happen with the keepers as well since i don't think their is any keeper in the land ATM who can hold a permanent place in the side in both forms of the game.
ATM you could say Mustard is the best option for ODI's, but the test matches hmmm its anyone guess. In test England need a keeper who is safe behind the stumps plus good enough with the bat to bat up @ 7 in the event that Flintoff gets injured.
Based on that you have Read who is having a fantastic time averaging about 60 i see, which is superb given how poor his batting still looked at test level last summer but you can understand that given the standard of bowling in division 2 that he has faced so personally i'm ruling him out not based on those two reasons.
James Foster has been ok without being prolific, rated highly as a good glovesman but is he test match material?.
Ambrose seems to be another one who is solid with the blade, not heard much talk of his keeping which is kinda worrying given that i'm hoping he is not another Jones or Prior in the making.
Young Steve Davies unfortunately was very prolific this year & was involved in a relegated Worcetershire side. So that will rule him out for now, but he one day may the the one to solve England's keeper woes finally.
Jonathan Batty & Nic Pothas, well they may not have long on the international stage if called up but they are the total package & looking at the Sri Lankan tour where we England will need a solid glovesman both have had the oppurtunity of keeping to some pretty good spinners. But then again i'm not so sure if Pothas wants to play for England given that he fits the kind of keeper England need ATM perfectly & Batty well his success as a batsman has come while opening for Surrey so maybe he won't be able to replicate that if called up given that he will bat down the order.
Then from right here Luke Sutton, just like Batty no-one really talks about him but since he came here after the Ashes summer, based on what i've seen of him the bloke looks good in both facets & has been averaging well in his 2 seasosn with the blade. Don't know if 2 seasons is good enough to convince the selectors probably one more would do the trick.
Look this is a big headache, England's selectors better try & convince Stewart to come out of retirement..
Looking at the county circuit i think just like how England have resorted to split captains in test & ODI's i think that may happen with the keepers as well since i don't think their is any keeper in the land ATM who can hold a permanent place in the side in both forms of the game.
ATM you could say Mustard is the best option for ODI's, but the test matches hmmm its anyone guess. In test England need a keeper who is safe behind the stumps plus good enough with the bat to bat up @ 7 in the event that Flintoff gets injured.
Based on that you have Read who is having a fantastic time averaging about 60 i see, which is superb given how poor his batting still looked at test level last summer but you can understand that given the standard of bowling in division 2 that he has faced so personally i'm ruling him out not based on those two reasons.
James Foster has been ok without being prolific, rated highly as a good glovesman but is he test match material?.
Ambrose seems to be another one who is solid with the blade, not heard much talk of his keeping which is kinda worrying given that i'm hoping he is not another Jones or Prior in the making.
Young Steve Davies unfortunately was very prolific this year & was involved in a relegated Worcetershire side. So that will rule him out for now, but he one day may the the one to solve England's keeper woes finally.
Jonathan Batty & Nic Pothas, well they may not have long on the international stage if called up but they are the total package & looking at the Sri Lankan tour where we England will need a solid glovesman both have had the oppurtunity of keeping to some pretty good spinners. But then again i'm not so sure if Pothas wants to play for England given that he fits the kind of keeper England need ATM perfectly & Batty well his success as a batsman has come while opening for Surrey so maybe he won't be able to replicate that if called up given that he will bat down the order.
Then from right here Luke Sutton, just like Batty no-one really talks about him but since he came here after the Ashes summer, based on what i've seen of him the bloke looks good in both facets & has been averaging well in his 2 seasosn with the blade. Don't know if 2 seasons is good enough to convince the selectors probably one more would do the trick.
Look this is a big headache, England's selectors better try & convince Stewart to come out of retirement..
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Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Next Prior here we come.
Bit of a shame he was hounded into retirement, really, wasn't it?
How stupid now do those clamouring for Read to replace him in 2003 look?
Pup Clarke
Cricketer Of The Year
No, cause unlike Prior he's actually done something in List-A cricket.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Prior had done something, too - in fact, exactly what Mustard has - had 1 good season. And been utterly awful otherwise (Mustard IIRR averaged 19 before this season).
If Mustard ever makes a success-story at ODIs I'll be flabbergasted (but I won't eat my computer, as that would give *certain types* too much satisfaction).
If Mustard ever makes a success-story at ODIs I'll be flabbergasted (but I won't eat my computer, as that would give *certain types* too much satisfaction).
Pup Clarke
Cricketer Of The Year
They've not got long to make this 2nd keeper decision aye, I mean candidates include Ambrose, Pothas, Read, Foster and Davies imo. We could all make a bet to think who will take the gloves behind Prior?
I'll say Ambrose as a darkhorse.
I'll say Ambrose as a darkhorse.
SpaceMonkey
International Debutant
Amrbose for Tests. Mustard for ODIs.
Mustard has put his turn up in form down to a different approach (basically deciding to attack a la Gilly). Which may explain why he has been so much better this season over others. Time will tell, as i feel England will stick with Prior for a while yet
Mustard has put his turn up in form down to a different approach (basically deciding to attack a la Gilly). Which may explain why he has been so much better this season over others. Time will tell, as i feel England will stick with Prior for a while yet
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
People put increased success down to "I decided to attack more, like so-and-so (often Gilchrist, especially for a wicketkeeper)" ATT, it's nothing I ever take remotely seriously TBH. Far more often than not it's said by a player who's always been an attacking player.
I don't doubt for a second the player (at least mostly) believes it - I do doubt his ability to correctly interpret the reasons for his success. "Attack more" is romantic nonsense quite often.
I don't doubt for a second the player (at least mostly) believes it - I do doubt his ability to correctly interpret the reasons for his success. "Attack more" is romantic nonsense quite often.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Davies still a bit too soon IMO; Ambrose not on 1 good season, always had the ability, maybe (but only maybe) starting to put it to use; Pothas too old these days; Read tried and failed.They've not got long to make this 2nd keeper decision aye, I mean candidates include Ambrose, Pothas, Read, Foster and Davies imo. We could all make a bet to think who will take the gloves behind Prior?
I'll say Ambrose as a darkhorse.
Simply has to be Foster for mine.
I'd still like to see Read in the ODIs tho. Averaged 57 this season (SR 108), that List-A-OD average just keeps going up. Better OD batsman than Prior has ever been.
Pup Clarke
Cricketer Of The Year
For the ODI's I'd like to see this team...
Alastair Cook
Andrew Flintoff
Ian Bell
Kevin Pietersen
Paul Collingwood
Ravi Bopara
Matt Prior
Dmitri Masceranhas
Graeme Swann
Stuart Broad
James Anderson
Great batting depth and I'm starting to think seriously about Flintoff opening.
Alastair Cook
Andrew Flintoff
Ian Bell
Kevin Pietersen
Paul Collingwood
Ravi Bopara
Matt Prior
Dmitri Masceranhas
Graeme Swann
Stuart Broad
James Anderson
Great batting depth and I'm starting to think seriously about Flintoff opening.
SpaceMonkey
International Debutant
Well i didnt say it was fact, but that is what he himself said. Surely he knows his own game better than anyone. The same could be said for Wright, but they still deserve a chance. Its not like we have a locked down ODI side is it?
As for Read, he looked woeful when he last played for England, couldnt even rotate the strike he was struggling to get bat on ball that much. He's no better than what Prior can do imo.
Woodster
International Captain
I agree with your points on the keepers, too soon for Davies, haven't seen that much of him, but from reading up on him it does seem a matter of when not if, he plays for England. Just not yet.
Ambrose, as you correctly say, imo, not just on one good season. Would be sceptical about whether Pothas would be the right choice, and I am a fan of Foster. If the Essex keeper would have had a better season with the bat, think this would be a straightforward choice.
I'm still giving Prior the benefit of the doubt at the minute, regarding ODI's. Prior as an opener ? Not 100% convinced, but all will be forgiven if he blazes a hundred tomorrow.