Zimbabwe are Improving!

[Marius]

I don't think it is long before Zimbabwe domestic loses first class status after this :

Wonder what the odds it'll lose Test status, I wonder what the precedent for that is? I don't think there is one?

But this is very sad for Zimbabwe, professional cricket won't survive for much longer in these kinds of conditions.

 

[Marius]

Since Afghanistan, Ireland and Scotland all have ODI status, we could see some movements in the bottom of the ODI rankings if those three tour Zimbabwe for the proposed tournament.

Right now it seems fairly doubtful that Zimbabwe will qualify for the 2019 World Cup.

 

[SeamUp]

Wonder what the odds it'll lose Test status, I wonder what the precedent for that is? I don't think there is one?

But this is very sad for Zimbabwe, professional cricket won't survive for much longer in these kinds of conditions.

Very interesting indeed.

The ICC are talking about wanting 14 really competitive teams, I just think it is a dream right now. Even in T20.

Test cricket is certainly going the other way where less teams are performing to the levels to be competitive.

As I quoted someone earlier in the thread where they said Zimbabwe will be following Kenya's path and I don't think they wrong. They have no structure in place to provide for the national team.

 

[Marius]

Very interesting indeed.

The ICC are talking about wanting 14 really competitive teams, I just think it is a dream right now. Even in T20.

Test cricket is certainly going the other way where less teams are performing to the levels to be competitive.

As I quoted someone earlier in the thread where they said Zimbabwe will be following Kenya's path and I don't think they wrong. They have no structure in place to provide for the national team.

Ireland and Afghanistan are the only two associates who are anything approaching being competitive now, but Scotland and Nepal have potential, perhaps Hong Kong, Namibia, and Papua New Guinea too

 

[andruid]

Recent 'white' Zimbabwean u19 players and where they are :

Peter Moor (25) : Zimbabwe cricket after England (Surrey 2nd XI)
Ryan Burl (21) : Zimbabwe cricket


Kyle Bowie (23) : Australia (Tasmania)
Malcolm Lake (22) : England (Oxford MCCU)
Kieran Geyle (22) : England
Brendan Deplock (21) : South Africa Uni
Gary King (20) : South Africa Uni
Jeremy Ives (20) : Played in the Africa Cup 3 months ago but not contracted !
Ed Byrom (19) : Contracted to Somerset
Richard Lock (19) : England
Shaun Snyder (19) : Australia
Adam Keefe (19) : Ireland
Nick Welch (18) : England (Sussex 2nd XI & MCC Young cricketers)
Brendan Sly (18) : Playing golf full-time
Ryan Murray (18) : South Africa Uni but played Africa T20 Cup 3 months ago and not contracted.
Angus Curtis (18) : Chose to rather sign a 3-year deal with Ulster in rugby union (schooled in South Africa at Hilton College which is same as Tom Curran where as Sam was still in Zimbabwe schooling before leaving for England) Tom and Sam Curran interview: Surrey brothers in arms with world at their feet | City A.M.

Their new batch is quite strong but they will probably all leave :

In recent school weeks in South Africa, Taun Harrison played for Western Province u17s as he is schooling at SACS now (former alma mater of Peter Kirsten) & Michael Frost & Michael Booth played for KZN Inland u15s as they are going to Hilton College like Curtis/Curran above which is the most expensive school to go to in South Africa

Some of the most famous names are:

RA MacLean (SA 1951-1965)
MJ Procter (SA 1966)
JHB Waite (SA 1951-1965)
DW Crookes (SA 1994)

Those schooling in Zimbabwe.

Trent Jayden (18)
Alistair Frost (17)
Liam Roche (17)
Kieran Robinson (17)
Greig Dollar (16)
Jonathan Connolly (16)
Declan Oldrieve (16)


There is no doubt this lot will follow Hilton Cartwright, Colin de Grandhomme, Gary Ballance if they got the opportunity or their Kolpak players like Brendan Taylor, Sean Ervine and Kyle Jarvis.

But if they had everyone available to them where could they potentially be ? Could they push the lower test nations or even be better than them ?

What about the black Zimbabweans that straight up cant afford to continue as cricketers? Are they not a loss to the game?

 

[Marius]

What about the black Zimbabweans that straight up cant afford to continue as cricketers? Are they not a loss to the game?

I don't think SeamUp implied that they weren't a loss to the game?

 

[andruid]

Very interesting indeed.

The ICC are talking about wanting 14 really competitive teams, I just think it is a dream right now. Even in T20.

Test cricket is certainly going the other way where less teams are performing to the levels to be competitive.

As I quoted someone earlier in the thread where they said Zimbabwe will be following Kenya's path and I don't think they wrong. They have no structure in place to provide for the national team.

Except that Kenya's economy is not circling the drain the way Zimbabwe's is so there is scope there to crawl back to respectability in a way that is not likely for Zimbabwe.

 

[andruid]

I don't think SeamUp implied that they weren't a loss to the game?

Then why not document their plight as closely?

 

[SeamUp]

Ireland and Afghanistan are the only two associates who are anything approaching being competitive now, but Scotland and Nepal have potential, perhaps Hong Kong, Namibia, and Papua New Guinea too

I must admit I haven't been keeping an eye on the associates of late.

Thought Irish cricket was going places but loss of talent to England and probably the lack of professional leadership letting them down from a structural point of view ? Scotland lost their main player who was a Saffer in Preston Mommsen recently so interesting to see how they do. I've heard the passion for cricket is surprisingly high amongst some Scots. Holland is another who seem to have a good domestic game started but major players like ten Doeschate, Kervezee not really playing much or in Kervezee's case didn't kick on.

Afghanistan certainly have the raw talent whilst UAE have the facilities.

But I still don't think they have a 50/50 chance against the elite yet. Cricket is such a unique game of individuals within a team sport. You just get found out.

 

[Marius]

Then why not document their plight as closely?

Do you keep a watch on their plight?

And it may also be that far fewer black Zimbabwean cricketers leave, than their white counterparts.

 

[91Jmay]

I reckon net English cricket helps more than hinders Irish cricket. They lose the occasional player but overall a good amount of their squad get to play CC + get quality facilities/coaches to work on their games.

 

[SeamUp]

To Andruid

Here is their contracted squads.

BULAWAYO METROPOLITAN TUSKERS

John Nyumbu (captain), Brian Chari (vice-captain), Bonaparte Mujuru, Nkosana Mpofu, Richmond Mutumbami, Craig Ervine, Sean Williams, Keith Dabengwa, Tafara Mupariwa, Luke Jongwe, Christopher Mpofu, Brian Vitori, Njabulo Ncube, Charlton Tshuma, Ainsley Ndlovu, Mbekezeli Mabuza, Cunningham Ncube, Stephen Chimhamhiwa, Ernest Masuku, Shoun Handirisi, Charles Kunje, Isheanopa Musekwa, Tawanda Bidi, Jeffrey Mhuriyengwe

HARARE METROPOLITAN EAGLES

Tinotenda Mutombodzi (captain), Cephas Zhuwawo, Nathan Waller (vice-captain), Regis Chakabva, Kudzai Maunze, Herbert Chikomba, Joylord Gumbie, Ryan Burl, Tafadzwa Muzarawetu, Simbarashe Gupo, Gary Chirimuuta, Cuthbert Musoko, Trevor Garwe, Taurai Muzarabani, Lavert Masunda, Gerald Aliseni, Tanyaradzwa Munyaradzi, Elton Chigumbura, Chamunorwa Chibhabha, Sikandar Raza

MANICALAND MOUNTAINEERS

Tinotenda Mawoyo (captain), Kevin Kasuza, Victor Nyauchi, William Mashinge, Kudzi Sauramba, Donald Tiripano (vice-captain), Tendai Chatara, Hamilton Masakadza, Vusi Sibanda, Timycen Maruma, Roy Kaia, Wellington Masakadza, Shingirai Masakadza, Tatenda Mupunga, Innocent Kaia, Natsai M’shangwe, Tapuwa Mufudza, Tinashe Kamunhukamwe, Tafadzwa Kamungozi, Forster Mutizwa, Blessing Muzarabani, Definate Mawadzi, John Masara, Clive Chitumba, Nigel Bonyongwe, Tendai Masunda, Frank Mazvita, Hendrick Macheke

MIDLANDS RHINOS

Graeme Cremer (captain), Bothwell Chapungu, Remembrance Nyathi, Mkhululi Nyathi, Tafara Chingwara, Michael Chinouya, Manson Chikowero, Wallace Mubayiwa, Prince Masvaure, Malcom Waller, Tarisai Musakanda, Peter Moor, Neville Madziva, Richard Muzhange, Tendai Chisoro, Carl Mumba, Tendai Maruma, Trevor Chibvongodze, Brandon Mavuta, Nyasha Mayavo, Kudakwashe Munyede, Jameson Chikowero, Bright Matsiwe, Richard Ngarava, Gilford Muzeya, Trevor Gwandu, Walter Matawu, Brendan Taylor, Dylan Hondo

The only 2 u19 players contracted were 'black African'. When you trying to produce a successful cricket team then you surely need to do all you can to bring in the best players you can and it seems there are issues with Zimbabwean white players & their u19 players being contracted when quite a few are frustrated that they not being approached and then have to leave for SA Uni. Obviously a lot leave for the UK, Aus and NZL too. But surely the aim should be to bring in all successful u19 cricketers ?

Whilst I agree players are lost and there are socio-economic problems that would be something the government has to address and Zimbabwe cricket can only do what they can to be as best they can be and right now their cricket board doesn't do that.

 

[SeamUp]

Except that Kenya's economy is not circling the drain the way Zimbabwe's is so there is scope there to crawl back to respectability in a way that is not likely for Zimbabwe.

Hope so.

Used to love watching Steve Tikolo and the boys competing.

There was something great about the minnows back in '96 and '99 particularly. 2003 was obviously great from a result perspective though for you guys in particular.

 

[SeamUp]

I reckon net English cricket helps more than hinders Irish cricket. They lose the occasional player but overall a good amount of their squad get to play CC + get quality facilities/coaches to work on their games.

In a way yes. Because they can become professional but it's almost like you can come and use my facilities but if I spot one of yours I like they mine and not yours. Which is frustrating and harsh to a minnow country ?

 

[Marius]

Hope so.

Used to love watching Steve Tikolo and the boys competing.

There was something great about the minnows back in '96 and '99 particularly. 2003 was obviously great from a result perspective though for you guys in particular.

Steve Tikolo might be (apart from the SA guys who didn't play because of isolation) one of the greatest cricketers to have never played a Test match.

 

[91Jmay]

In a way yes. Because they can become professional but it's almost like you can come and use my facilities but if I spot one of yours I like they mine and not yours. Which is frustrating and harsh to a minnow country ?

Yeah, I am not defending the ECB more saying that i think overall it is a benefit to them. Is Eoin Morgan the player he is today without Middlesex? Doubtful. He started playing cricket in England as a boy at Dulwich College, so whilst Ireland have a right to be aggrieved to a degree the English structure certainly helped him develop.

 

[marc71178]

In a way yes. Because they can become professional but it's almost like you can come and use my facilities but if I spot one of yours I like they mine and not yours. Which is frustrating and harsh to a minnow country ?

Far better for them then them not getting the use of the facilities and training.

 

[andruid]

Do you keep a watch on their plight?

And it may also be that far fewer black Zimbabwean cricketers leave, than their white counterparts.

I haven't had an opportunity to follow Zimbabwe's domestic game closely but considering the overall demographics in Zimbabwe it would paint a much more complete picture to consider all youth set up players forced off the path to representing Zimbabwe for whatever reason regardless of race

 

[Marius]

I haven't had an opportunity to follow Zimbabwe's domestic game closely but considering the overall demographics in Zimbabwe it would paint a much more complete picture to consider all youth set up players forced off the path to representing Zimbabwe for whatever reason regardless of race

I think looking at how white players are leaving the game in Zimbabwe is relevant. After all, in ht eUK people have spoken about the lack of Black British and people of Caribbean origin in the game in the UK today, especially compared to the 1970s and 1980s.

And the pressures on black players are probably different than on white players. The only young black player from Zimbabwe that has left in recent years that I can think of is Solomon Mire.

 

[cnerd123]

Ireland and Afghanistan are the only two associates who are anything approaching being competitive now, but Scotland and Nepal have potential, perhaps Hong Kong, Namibia, and Papua New Guinea too

Just FTR, any mention of HK cricket in a positive light earns a like from me.

Keep up the good work.