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Why can't Pakistan produce prolific fast bowlers anymore?
- Thread starter Everton Seymour
- Start date
Migara
International Coach
They are quite old when they come in. So called teens some times are in middle 20s. By then they have learnt all the destructive attributes that can end a career. No wonder they crash in and crash out.
Sri Lanka and India, if they are young, they are. There is enough time to weed out attributes that prevent a good work ethic. That may be the reason, Sri lankan and Indian fast bowlers, although not as good as to start as Pakistani ones, improve and last.
Athlai
Not Terrible
They wish
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Benji Marshall > Imran Khan
Burgey
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The Tigers or Pakistan?
Starfighter
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
This is a silly question. They never did.
Going with the 200 wicket cutoff since 1945 we end up with:
Aus: 13
Eng: 13
SA: 8
WI: 7
NZ: 6
Ind: 5
Pak: 3
Imran and the two W's aside, Pakistan simply doesn't produce prolific fast bowlers. The applied as much before Imran as to does now. Shoaib got closest but he was as fragile as you'd expect a bowler like him to be. Maybe if he'd put maximum effort into fitness he might have made it. Asif probably would have except... you know. If you look prior to Imran it was a desert.
No matter people banging on about the next Akram or favour of the month wonder kid, Pakistan is not a great country for fast bowlers or prolific bowlers in general really.
Going with the 200 wicket cutoff since 1945 we end up with:
Aus: 13
Eng: 13
SA: 8
WI: 7
NZ: 6
Ind: 5
Pak: 3
Imran and the two W's aside, Pakistan simply doesn't produce prolific fast bowlers. The applied as much before Imran as to does now. Shoaib got closest but he was as fragile as you'd expect a bowler like him to be. Maybe if he'd put maximum effort into fitness he might have made it. Asif probably would have except... you know. If you look prior to Imran it was a desert.
No matter people banging on about the next Akram or favour of the month wonder kid, Pakistan is not a great country for fast bowlers or prolific bowlers in general really.
Everton Seymour
U19 Debutant
What's really silly is using a cutoff since 1945 , Pakistan was not even Pakistan in 1945.
Pakistan first played a test match in 1952 , from 1952-1972 Pakistan only played 65 tests , 20 years for 60 odd tests ... Pakistan's first Real quality seamer Fazal Mahmood could only play 34 test matches in this period , Hanif Mohammad had a 17 year test career in that period and only played 55 tests ...So no point making a cutoff without context I mean Younis Khan had a 15 year Test career in the 21st century and played 118 tests .
It was the 70's when Sarfraz Nawaz and Imran Khan burst onto the scene with a greater opportunity to play Tests (73-92 Pakistan played close to 150 tests)
that a fast bowling culture was developing , then Wasim and Waqar took it up a notch again ..
95-Present is 27 years , that is a quarter of a century with test matches played more frequently than ever and money , technology, fitness techniques etc better than it was in the last century yet no Pakistani seamer has 200 test wickets ? The generation that saw Imran Khan lift the world cup in 1992 and the brilliance of Wasim and Waqar can't continue the legacy ? That isn't silly that should be questioned if you want a strong Pakistan team .
Pakistan first played a test match in 1952 , from 1952-1972 Pakistan only played 65 tests , 20 years for 60 odd tests ... Pakistan's first Real quality seamer Fazal Mahmood could only play 34 test matches in this period , Hanif Mohammad had a 17 year test career in that period and only played 55 tests ...So no point making a cutoff without context I mean Younis Khan had a 15 year Test career in the 21st century and played 118 tests .
It was the 70's when Sarfraz Nawaz and Imran Khan burst onto the scene with a greater opportunity to play Tests (73-92 Pakistan played close to 150 tests)
that a fast bowling culture was developing , then Wasim and Waqar took it up a notch again ..
95-Present is 27 years , that is a quarter of a century with test matches played more frequently than ever and money , technology, fitness techniques etc better than it was in the last century yet no Pakistani seamer has 200 test wickets ? The generation that saw Imran Khan lift the world cup in 1992 and the brilliance of Wasim and Waqar can't continue the legacy ? That isn't silly that should be questioned if you want a strong Pakistan team .
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Flem274*
123/5
Bit tipsy but this could almost be a list of access to facilities. Gotta nuture your quicks early.
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
It's quite simple really. Without attention to fitness and institutional backing, bowlers can't have full careers. Pakistan cricket has neither.
The exception was Imran, Wasim and Waqar. Imran was groomed in county cricket and then WSC exposed him to the highest standards of fast bowling and he excelled. Wasim and Waqar were personally mentored by him to allow them to have full careers too.
Not a single spinner has taken 300 wickets in Pakistan and not a single pacer since Waqar has taken over 200. The bowlers with the most are all products of the Imran era.
The perils of the system in Pakistan are so high that you need some exceptional hand of God to succeed in the long term as a bowler. Either the selector will throw you out in the lurch the moment your form drops, your captain won't back you or will bribe you, or you will suffer some stupid injury because you didn't get basic advice on fitness standards at the start of your career.
If Lillee and Warne played for Pakistan, they would have likely never returned back to the side once they got their respective back and shoulder injuries. Cummins also.
The exception was Imran, Wasim and Waqar. Imran was groomed in county cricket and then WSC exposed him to the highest standards of fast bowling and he excelled. Wasim and Waqar were personally mentored by him to allow them to have full careers too.
Not a single spinner has taken 300 wickets in Pakistan and not a single pacer since Waqar has taken over 200. The bowlers with the most are all products of the Imran era.
The perils of the system in Pakistan are so high that you need some exceptional hand of God to succeed in the long term as a bowler. Either the selector will throw you out in the lurch the moment your form drops, your captain won't back you or will bribe you, or you will suffer some stupid injury because you didn't get basic advice on fitness standards at the start of your career.
If Lillee and Warne played for Pakistan, they would have likely never returned back to the side once they got their respective back and shoulder injuries. Cummins also.
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Starfighter
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Doesn't matter. The premise is that Pakistan don't produce prolific bowlers anymore, when they never really did.
trundler
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And the ones they did were cheats, innit?
A new test nation starting out with Fazal and Khan Mohammad is practically unheard of and over the last 20 odd years there's always been someone around who's started well. The issue is obviously those guys fading away, rather than the production of fast bowling talent.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Yeah I don't think anyone's saying Pakistan don't produce fast bowling talent, just that they don't produce quicks who have long (prolific) careers.
In a way part of it might be that they don't really need to. If your senior infrastructure is substandard but your talent production is good you can basically replace a 10 year career with 3 three-year peaks just as effectively.
Daemon
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flem likes this
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
Supply was never an issue with Pakistan, its shelflife. Even Australia is only able to produce true worldclass ATG talent at best once a decade.
Pakistan actually needs more Siddle, Broad type reliable bowlers who can scaffhold the attack for the worldclass talents like Shaheen to shine. Just 1-2 steady bowlers capable of long careers. Otherwise it's way too much pressure for any Pakistani ace to deliver long term. The closest we had is Umar Gul.