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Who is a better young all-rounder Watson or Bravo
- Thread starter aussie
- Start date
aussie
Hall of Fame Member
This is interesting topic to look back on because now that they both have retired from tests for different reasons this - in a lot of ways like Abdur Razzaq & Azhar Mahmood, they were two all-rounders who started brightly & i thought would go on to have impressive carers - but ended up not living up to expectations in tests - but being better in ODI/T20 cricket.
Of the five players alongside Michael Clarke, Ryan Harris, Brad Haddin and Chis Rogers to retire from Test cricket following the Ashes series loss, their careers were generally praised by the Australian media for what they accomplished, Watson thought the least glowing reaction.
In an ESPN Cricinfo article titled “flexible in skill, inflexible in body” - Brydon Coverdale: Shane Watson - flexible of skill, inflexible of body | Cricket | ESPN Cricinfo Watson’s Test career is summarised as one where he was given many chances by a succession of selectors, coaches and captains but due to injuries and technical faults, never fully became the Test all-rounder expected of him.
In the middle of the 2000s era, both Watson and Bravo had emerged with much hype. Bravo made his mark in two high profile overseas tours to England and Australia where he registered what remains his highest Test score and bowling figures.
West Indies clearly had their most genuine all-rounder since the great Sir Gary Sobers while Watson’s early performances made Australia feel he would become their version of Jacques Kallis.
The Twenty20 revolution via the IPL happened in 2008 and both players have been key players for their respective IPL franchises - Chennai Super Kings and Rajasthan Royals.
Australia never had any issue negotiating with Watson when fit over sharing his time between IPL and nation duty.
However, West Indies’ poor player vs board relations caused much drama over Bravo’s availability due to his T20 commitments.
The choice of Darren Sammy as Test captain further limited the amount of Tests he played after 2010.
In 2014, Bravo became a Malta Carib Brand ambassador in his native T&t and was quoted on the stating Up in the air: Bravo?s plans for world domination | Wired868
“I never imagined I would go this long without playing Test cricket...My brother (Darren Bravo) has played 30 Tests now and we only got to play together three times.” He continued: “In order to become a household name in cricket and to earn worldwide recognition, you have to play Test cricket. That is where I got my start… Things like my maiden Test 100 in Australia; and six for 55 in England and six for 84 in Australia.
“Tests are the highest level for cricketers, I am just 14 Test wickets from 100 and I know I could do better with the bat. I would like to get ten Test centuries.”
The early days of 2014 gave Bravo optimism that his Test career would take off with Clyde Butts and Darren Sammy being removed as Chairman of Selectors and Test captain respectively.
New selector and Windies legend Clive Lloyd and new captain Denesh Ramdin were ready for the home series against New Zealand where Bravo was selected in the initial Test squad for the first time since 2010, only to miss out because of a shoulder injury he suffered during IPL 2014.
After not being chosen for the two home Tests against Bangladesh due to clashes in the now defunct Twenty20 Champions League, the Windies then had 11 Tests against India, South Africa, England, Australia to reincorporate Bravo to prove to the world that the team can replicate its Twenty20 form in Tests.
But another obstacle would emerge with the ill-fated tour of India w& Bravo announced his retirement from Tests and later cited his dissatisfaction with the new MOU/CBA pay structure for Test matches which was the primary cause of the abandoned India tour.
With all-rounder Andre Russell not available to play the longer format due to knee problems similar to Lasith Malinga, Bravo’s presence in the longer format is seriously missed for Windies.
Despite this, Clive Lloyd is now risking his reputation and the team’s balance by adding more burden on Jason Holder to become an all-rounder in Tests.
Holder though is a bowler who is a competent number eight batsman that can contribute runs similarly to Mitchell Johnson or Ravi Ashwin.
You don’t see Australia and India trying to turn them into all-rounders though.
Most of the senior Windies players share Bravo’s sentiment over the Test match pay structure, A quality all-rounder in the modern game is gold for a captain and almost all the Test nations have or are trying to incorporate such a player in their XI namely: Ben Stokes, Mitchell Marsh, Jimmy Neesham, Shakib Al-Hasan, Corey Anderson, Angelo Mathews. Heck even India has been trying uselessly to turn Stuart Binny into one.
None of those players are immensely more talented than IMO Bravo, so considering the aforementioned facts of his career – we can safely say unlike Australia and Watson – West Indies selectors have failed to utilise and get the best out Dwayne Bravo, the Test cricketer, before he was forced into premature retirement.
Of the five players alongside Michael Clarke, Ryan Harris, Brad Haddin and Chis Rogers to retire from Test cricket following the Ashes series loss, their careers were generally praised by the Australian media for what they accomplished, Watson thought the least glowing reaction.
In an ESPN Cricinfo article titled “flexible in skill, inflexible in body” - Brydon Coverdale: Shane Watson - flexible of skill, inflexible of body | Cricket | ESPN Cricinfo Watson’s Test career is summarised as one where he was given many chances by a succession of selectors, coaches and captains but due to injuries and technical faults, never fully became the Test all-rounder expected of him.
In the middle of the 2000s era, both Watson and Bravo had emerged with much hype. Bravo made his mark in two high profile overseas tours to England and Australia where he registered what remains his highest Test score and bowling figures.
West Indies clearly had their most genuine all-rounder since the great Sir Gary Sobers while Watson’s early performances made Australia feel he would become their version of Jacques Kallis.
The Twenty20 revolution via the IPL happened in 2008 and both players have been key players for their respective IPL franchises - Chennai Super Kings and Rajasthan Royals.
Australia never had any issue negotiating with Watson when fit over sharing his time between IPL and nation duty.
However, West Indies’ poor player vs board relations caused much drama over Bravo’s availability due to his T20 commitments.
The choice of Darren Sammy as Test captain further limited the amount of Tests he played after 2010.
In 2014, Bravo became a Malta Carib Brand ambassador in his native T&t and was quoted on the stating Up in the air: Bravo?s plans for world domination | Wired868
“I never imagined I would go this long without playing Test cricket...My brother (Darren Bravo) has played 30 Tests now and we only got to play together three times.” He continued: “In order to become a household name in cricket and to earn worldwide recognition, you have to play Test cricket. That is where I got my start… Things like my maiden Test 100 in Australia; and six for 55 in England and six for 84 in Australia.
“Tests are the highest level for cricketers, I am just 14 Test wickets from 100 and I know I could do better with the bat. I would like to get ten Test centuries.”
The early days of 2014 gave Bravo optimism that his Test career would take off with Clyde Butts and Darren Sammy being removed as Chairman of Selectors and Test captain respectively.
New selector and Windies legend Clive Lloyd and new captain Denesh Ramdin were ready for the home series against New Zealand where Bravo was selected in the initial Test squad for the first time since 2010, only to miss out because of a shoulder injury he suffered during IPL 2014.
After not being chosen for the two home Tests against Bangladesh due to clashes in the now defunct Twenty20 Champions League, the Windies then had 11 Tests against India, South Africa, England, Australia to reincorporate Bravo to prove to the world that the team can replicate its Twenty20 form in Tests.
But another obstacle would emerge with the ill-fated tour of India w& Bravo announced his retirement from Tests and later cited his dissatisfaction with the new MOU/CBA pay structure for Test matches which was the primary cause of the abandoned India tour.
With all-rounder Andre Russell not available to play the longer format due to knee problems similar to Lasith Malinga, Bravo’s presence in the longer format is seriously missed for Windies.
Despite this, Clive Lloyd is now risking his reputation and the team’s balance by adding more burden on Jason Holder to become an all-rounder in Tests.
Holder though is a bowler who is a competent number eight batsman that can contribute runs similarly to Mitchell Johnson or Ravi Ashwin.
You don’t see Australia and India trying to turn them into all-rounders though.
Most of the senior Windies players share Bravo’s sentiment over the Test match pay structure, A quality all-rounder in the modern game is gold for a captain and almost all the Test nations have or are trying to incorporate such a player in their XI namely: Ben Stokes, Mitchell Marsh, Jimmy Neesham, Shakib Al-Hasan, Corey Anderson, Angelo Mathews. Heck even India has been trying uselessly to turn Stuart Binny into one.
None of those players are immensely more talented than IMO Bravo, so considering the aforementioned facts of his career – we can safely say unlike Australia and Watson – West Indies selectors have failed to utilise and get the best out Dwayne Bravo, the Test cricketer, before he was forced into premature retirement.
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Jono
Virat Kohli (c)
Furball
Evil Scotsman
Bravo was a spud. Symbolic of the West Indies massive decline that anyone thought he was anything more than a handy drinks carrier.
vic_orthdox
Global Moderator
The guy could have been a top 6 bat, but because of the holes in the side he ended up being one of the best four bowlers at times for them. He wasn't good enough to carry that sort of load; ended up being not good enough in either.