Where does Ricky Ponting rank?

[Ikki]

How does Tendulkar seem to be doing these days? Same for Lara? I hear Brian's doing well recently but it wasn't so just a while back. Isn't batting supposed to be easier these days?

 

[Evermind]

How does Tendulkar seem to be doing these days? Same for Lara? I hear Brian's doing well recently but it wasn't so just a while back. Isn't batting supposed to be easier these days?

Not when you're 43 years old, or something.

Anyway why shouldn't Ponting be considered to be in the same class as Lara and Tendulkar? He has been a far more reliable match-winner than Tendulkar, and generally more consistent than Lara. He might not be as fun to watch (I admit this) but no reason it's "ridiculous" to put him on the same level as them. He's probably gonna end up with better stats than them at the end of his career, anyway.

 

[adharcric]

How does Tendulkar seem to be doing these days? Same for Lara? I hear Brian's doing well recently but it wasn't so just a while back. Isn't batting supposed to be easier these days?

Let's hope you aren't serious with this one. Lara and Tendulkar are at the end of illustrious careers played primarily on tougher pitches against tougher attacks.

 

[adharcric]

Not when you're 43 years old, or something.

Anyway why shouldn't Ponting be considered to be in the same class as Lara and Tendulkar? He has been a far more reliable match-winner than Tendulkar, and generally more consistent than Lara. He might not be as fun to watch (I admit this) but no reason it's "ridiculous" to put him on the same level as them. He's probably gonna end up with better stats than them at the end of his career, anyway.

Everyone knows that his stats will be better. The argument is about whether those stats are heavily skewed or not.

 

[C_C]

How does Tendulkar seem to be doing these days? Same for Lara? I hear Brian's doing well recently but it wasn't so just a while back. Isn't batting supposed to be easier these days?

Doesnt matter. Tendy and Lara have a lot more miles on them than Ponting- especially Tendy, who is the oldest playing international cricketer today.
And its a given that different batsmen will have peaks at different times. The fact is, Lara's first peak and Tendulkar's peak are/were better than anything Ponting has come up with once you look beyond simple numbers.
And for the simple fact that Tendulkar and Lara have proven themselves against every opposition ( mostly of higher quality than Ponting has) in every condition unlike Ponting ranks them ahead of Ponting.

 

[Craig]

No, they are not. Sure, the pitches might be flatter than average but playing in India is very different from playing in Sri Lanka. A hundred on-field and off-the-field things are completely different. A lot of players succeed in one place and not the other.

Erm I believe I was talking about ODIs?

For me, Bangladesh are no more a Test-class team than Warwickshire.

The relevance is that it's possible to play a quality innings against a non-Test-class team, whether that team's Bangladesh or Warwickshire - and it's Test-class, not Test-playing, that matters to me.

We'll agree to disagree then?

Regardless of the stats Ponting posts, unless he scores runs vs top callibre bowling like McWarne like those two have while batting in a weak batting lineup and succeeds in India, Ponting would never be in Lara-Tendulkar class.

Granted I never saw cricket played in the 80's (except highlights) but couldn't you say that about the West Indian team in that period as well? Viv Richards never had to face the likes of Holding, Marshall, Garner, Roberts (unless in County Cricket) at Test level.

 

[Richard]

We'll agree to disagree then?

Yep.

 

[Richard]

once you look beyond simple numbers.

 

[Richard]

Anyway why shouldn't Ponting be considered to be in the same class as Lara and Tendulkar? He has been a far more reliable match-winner than Tendulkar

No, his bowlers have.

To bash a batsman as "not being a matchwinner" is pretty mad, to break-up the monotony of "ridiculous".

 

[social]

Doesnt matter. Tendy and Lara have a lot more miles on them than Ponting- especially Tendy, who is the oldest playing international cricketer today.
And its a given that different batsmen will have peaks at different times. The fact is, Lara's first peak and Tendulkar's peak are/were better than anything Ponting has come up with once you look beyond simple numbers.
And for the simple fact that Tendulkar and Lara have proven themselves against every opposition ( mostly of higher quality than Ponting has) in every condition unlike Ponting ranks them ahead of Ponting.

Ponting has a great hole in his record - India in India

Aside from that anomaly (and I think it has to be regarded as such, given his record elsewhere), he's as good as anyone bar Bradman

That being said, I personally favour Tendulkar and Lara over him from a purely aesthetic perspective.

I would not cross the road to watch Ponting bat (nor Dravid for that matter) as he has reduced batting to its' simplest form and makes everything look ridiculously easy and predictable - and that's probably the highest compliment I can give him.

Lara, on the other hand, is a flawed genius that can make the impossible look easy whilst Tendulkar was, at his best, technically the best I've seen and both were impossible to bowl to.

 

[archie mac]

At the moment for Aussies

Bradman
GSC
Ponting

But Punter has not finished yet

 

[The_Bunny]

At the moment for Aussies

Bradman
GSC
Ponting

But Punter has not finished yet

It would be amusing if Ponting played for another 9 years and scored 20,000 test/ odi runs

*Ducks*

 

[Ikki]

Not when you're 43 years old, or something.

Anyway why shouldn't Ponting be considered to be in the same class as Lara and Tendulkar? He has been a far more reliable match-winner than Tendulkar, and generally more consistent than Lara. He might not be as fun to watch (I admit this) but no reason it's "ridiculous" to put him on the same level as them. He's probably gonna end up with better stats than them at the end of his career, anyway.

Tendulkar is only 1 year older than Ponting. Lara, that's something, he's 5 years older. But Lara is doing well despite his age. So there goes that theory.

 

[Ikki]

Let's hope you aren't serious with this one. Lara and Tendulkar are at the end of illustrious careers played primarily on tougher pitches against tougher attacks.

Lara has played 21 more tests than Ponting, Sachin has played 25 more tests than Ponting. Assuming by the end of their career that Ponting has broken all their records (bar the ridiculous 400s by Lara) do you think his record will be that inferior to Sachin and Brian? I really don't think playing a couple years later is in Ponting's favour that much.

Doesnt matter. Tendy and Lara have a lot more miles on them than Ponting- especially Tendy, who is the oldest playing international cricketer today.
And its a given that different batsmen will have peaks at different times. The fact is, Lara's first peak and Tendulkar's peak are/were better than anything Ponting has come up with once you look beyond simple numbers.
And for the simple fact that Tendulkar and Lara have proven themselves against every opposition ( mostly of higher quality than Ponting has) in every condition unlike Ponting ranks them ahead of Ponting.

Actually Tendulkar is not the older player today. Yes, Batsmen will peak at different times, just as they will struggle at others. Now either Tendulkar is really off form since he doesn't come near Ponting at the moment or Ponting is really on form - in which both cases rules out the 'condusive batting conditions'.

 

[Ikki]

Player comparison from 2000 onwards.

                [B]Mat  I   NO  Runs HS1  HS2  HS3    Ave  100  50   0[/B]
[B]Ponting[/B]         77  131  20  7276 257  242  207   65.54  27  26   5
[B]Lara[/B]            66  120   2  6380 400* 226  221   54.06  21  19  13
[B]Tendulkar[/B]       62  102  10  4827 248* 241* 201*  52.46  13  20   6

Yes, Ponting debuted in 94, Sachin about 5 years prior and Lara about the same time as well. They are clearly better in the 90s, but quite behind in the 00s. Whether you think Ponting is inflated that much can be based on a lot of things but I think least of all age and playing games because Lara is quite older than the other two yet is still doing well, and Ponting has played more tests than the other two in the last 7 years.

 

[Johnners]

that was my understanding of it as well

 

[pasag]

Oops Clapo, accidently deleted my post above yours. Back now.

Actually Tendulkar is not the older player today.

He means the time they've played the game, ie years from debut, I think.

 

[social]

Sorry, when I suggested above that Ponting was "the best bar Bradman" it was in reference to Oz players only.

The best player I've seen, by a long way, was Viv

 

[silentstriker]

Player comparison from 2000 onwards.

                [B]Mat  I   NO  Runs HS1  HS2  HS3    Ave  100  50   0[/B]
[B]Ponting[/B]         77  131  20  7276 257  242  207   65.54  27  26   5
[B]Lara[/B]            66  120   2  6380 400* 226  221   54.06  21  19  13
[B]Tendulkar[/B]       62  102  10  4827 248* 241* 201*  52.46  13  20   6

Yes, Ponting debuted in 94, Sachin about 5 years prior and Lara about the same time as well. They are clearly better in the 90s, but quite behind in the 00s. Whether you think Ponting is inflated that much can be based on a lot of things but I think least of all age and playing games because Lara is quite older than the other two yet is still doing well, and Ponting has played more tests than the other two in the last 7 years.

As has been mentioned, its not about age. Playing international cricket for 18 years is quite different, on the body it really takes its toll. Sachin has been playing since age of 16, so despite being only slightly older, he has many more miles on it. And I'm glad you compared the prime of one player vs the downside of another. Makes complete sense.

 

[mjtaba]

Ponting is one of the very best Australia ever produced

i believe that comparing players from different era is not difficult but basically stupid.Cricket is not Rocket science all you have to see that the two individuals characteristics and achievements in there very prime .For example Inzamam at his very best against the toughest competion in his prime is still not equal to a lara or Sachin.
.
But ponting is a different story,i personally believe that ponting has achieved more then any batsman ever produced by Australia in the modern evolving age of cricket ,Don Bradman was good no doubt but is u have a 3D match between Ponting and Bradman like Muhammad Ali and Rocky Marciano all my bets will be on Ponting