Viv Richards vs Sydney Barnes

[Johan]

Better Test Cricketer?

 

[DrWolverine]

 

[Johan]

 

[vidiq]

 

[Migara]

Barnes, when adjusted for the era averages in the 20-22 range. So these two are pretty comparable. Both were dicks on the field, but for VIv it was an act to show the dominance, egged by the geo political necessities of the era. He actually is a nice man according to people who had met him. I don't hear anything as such about Barnes.
Viv conquered more vatied conditions. Hence he gets the vote.

 

[subshakerz]

Barnes? Come on. He ain't a serious threat to Viv.

 

[sayon basak]

 

[Johan]

Barnes? Come on. He ain't a serious threat to Viv.

How is the 16 averaging bowler not a serious threat to the barely over 50 Batsman?

 

[sayon basak]

 

[Migara]

How is the 16 averaging bowler not a serious threat to the barely over 50 Batsman?

because overall batting average was about 25 IiRC during his time.

 

[Johan]

because overall batting average was about 25 IiRC during his time.

even if you adjust, Barnes is gonna come down to 20-21, which is still more than a threat to a 50 avg Batsman.

 

[Migara]

even if you adjust, Barnes is gonna come down to 20-21, which is still more than a threat to a 50 avg Batsman.

Sure. That's why said they are comparable. If after ajusting Barnes was around 18 - 19 I would strongly consider him.

Viv wins because he played more varied conditions.

 

[Johan]

Sure. That's why said they are comparable. If after ajusting Barnes was around 18 - 19 I would strongly consider him.

Viv wins because he played more varied conditions.

Barnes would've more impact on the games though, he can get on one end and bowl for eternity, you'd be getting the quality and skill of an elite ATG fast bowler with the workload ability of a spinner.

 

[Migara]

Barnes would've more impact on the games though, he can get on one end and bowl for eternity, you'd be getting the quality and skill of an elite ATG fast bowler with the workload ability of a spinner.

I don't consider Barnes to be a fast bowler. He is by all accounts a quick spinner like Kumble or Afridi, and send a seam up ball which was pretty sharp (just like Afridi). Don't think he woukd run up whole day and deliver 30 over spell averagin 130k. He must have liked the new ball becase of the bounce.

 

[Johan]

I don't consider Barnes to be a fast bowler. He is by all accounts a quick spinner like Kumble or Afridi, and send a seam up ball which was pretty sharp (just like Afridi). Don't think he woukd run up whole day and deliver 30 over spell averagin 130k. He must have liked tge new ball becase of the bounce.

By all accounts he was a pacer, he swung the ball, he never "spun" the ball but bowled excellent "cuts" IE cutters, there was no confusion in what he bowled among those who saw him, he created the confusion himself by going out and telling the media all kind of weird stories so that they stop comparing Maurice Tate to his style which he took as an insult. The bowler Barnes himself in late life confirmed he was like, was Alec Bedser.

the English captain of the 1903-04 Ashes, Pelham Warner, confirmed his "breaks" were "cut rather than spun".

 

[Migara]

By all accounts he was a pacer, he swung the ball, he never "spun" the ball but bowled excellent "cuts" IE cutters, there was no confusion in what he bowled among those who saw him, he created the confusion himself by going out and telling the media all kind of weird stories so that they stop comparing Maurice Tate to his style which he took as an insult. The bowler Barnes himself in late life confirmed he was like, was Alec Bedser.

I tend to disagree. By all accounts and the grip, he snapped the ball out like a carom balls. If I am not mistaken, people could hear the snap of his fingers when bowling. (Later happened the same with Grimmer's flipper). That expaain why he love the new ball, because these kinds of balls slide and bounce low. The new ball when it hits the seam it creates variable bounce.

 

[Johan]

I tend to disagree. By all means andthe grip, he snapped the ball out like carom balls. If I am not mistaken, people could hear the snap of his fingers when bowling. (Later happened the same with Grimmer's flipper). That expaain why he love the new ball, because yhese kinds of balls slide and bounce low. The new ball when it hits the seam icreates variable bounce.

I think he just bowled cutters with extreme movement, swung the ball at first and got unnatural bounce, he definitely had a runup and is unanimously described as a medium pacer, I think Bedser and Tate are probably the perfect analogies as their are stories of people hearing Bedser's fingers while bowling as well.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Sure. That's why said they are comparable. If after ajusting Barnes was around 18 - 19 I would strongly consider him.

Viv wins because he played more varied conditions.

Barnes also has a 7 WPM

 

[subshakerz]

How is the 16 averaging bowler not a serious threat to the barely over 50 Batsman?

Not you too.

 

[Johan]

Not you too.

It's bait factual, but on a serious note, it should be decently debateable